1985-07_17 Impermanence_ The Universe As Teacher Q&A - 2

Talk: 19850717-Larry_Rosenberg-UNK-impermanence_the_universe_as_teacher-1527.json Start_time: 01:26:41 Display_question: Why do I experience a division between retreat and “real life”? Keyword_search: retreat, life, the work, Gurdjieff, meditation, work, Vipassana, division, peace, stillness, qualitative, morning, car, attention, awareness, observe, music, week Question_content: Questioner: Yeah. Okay. I'd like to maybe inquire a little bit into the difference between retreat and the whole concept of just life. For me, when I started doing this sort of not this particular practice, I started doing sort of Gurdjieff type work. They didn't call it meditation. They called it “the work.” Whatever you did was in and out. There was no sitting or anything like that. And then I went to a Vipassana retreat, and it was, like, very powerful for me because I had a very experiential awareness of something that they had talked about in Gurdjieff. From that point on, my experience was that there suddenly became a division between retreat and the rest of life. Even though I had been sort of indoctrinated in the idea of “the work” in general, there was one part of my understanding that it had the whole thing, and the other part was that where you really got it was in retreat. Larry: Right. Questioner: And I've been struggling with that ever since then. And when I hear you speak and, you know, the conversations we've had over the past years, maybe, and again today, you know, one part of me is saying yes, yes, yes, yes. And the other part is saying, well, but every time I leave the retreat and I go out there, qualitatively, it's different. Larry: Yes, I understand your question now. That's the problem. In other words, there are certain kinds of things that are attainable here. That's what I meant, which can be more dramatic. You know, you sit for a few weeks, sometimes you can just get tremendous peace, right? Tremendous stillness, ecstasy, real fulfillment, cut through a problem that you've been carrying around for a long time. And, by and large, let's say you don't have that kind of dramatic experience unless you take drugs out there. And so, of course, that comes to stand for it. That's the problem. Questioner: Can I give you an example? I'll give you an example because I kind of been working with this. Like, let's say I sit in the morning and I make a resolve: Okay, today I'm going to stay mindful. So I get in the car. The first five minutes I'm watching the breath. Then I turn the radio on, and the music is nice, and I start fantasizing about the music. Then what am I going to do at work? Then I start tripping on all the things I have to do. Then I go through the door. And then at 07:00 in the evening, I remember that I was supposed to stay mindful when I got in the car. And I went out to 12 hours of whatever I do at work with very little awareness. Maybe once in a while I remember to pay attention or to observe myself at some point, but the rest of the time, which is different to what happens to me in the retreat, which is that the awareness is much more continuous. Larry: Yes, it sounds like at least one thing is that you're more highly motivated to pay attention when you're here than when you're in quotes “there.” Why? See, now this becomes part of the practice itself. Inquiry. Okay, fine. You do this, you come here, and wonderful experiences. You go there, space cadet. You don't know what's going on. If that doesn't matter to you, full speed ahead. But probably what you're finding out is there's a price to be paid for living that way. Since how many weeks do you spend here during a year? Let's say this year. Questioner: This year is only one week. Larry: Let's make it five weeks. Okay. Look how much the rest of your time is in that car with the music, with everything you say. End_time: 01:30:41