Music for Cats..Marks Redo

David Tai, a cellist with the National Symphony Orchestra, has conducted studies on music and animals. He has worked with Metallica bassist Jason Neustadt and developed music for cats, dogs, and monkeys. The music has positive effects on animals, especially those that have been abused or traumatized. It may also have potential benefits for animals in specific situations, such as rescue dogs or dogs suffering from PTSD. David's work is driven by a passion for music and its impact on animals. Hey everybody and welcome back to the for real podcast. Today we've got a really good one. Today we have joining with us is a man who's actually a cellist with the National Symphony Orchestra but he's done these great studies with music and animals. So please join me in welcoming David Tai. David welcome and let's just jump right in there and can you talk and tell us a little bit about everything. Let's start off with a little bit about your background. Now you you're a third-generation musician so you've basically been surrounded by music your entire life. So I'm guessing you just got to have a huge passion for music right? Oh I'm right there with you. I've got music playing a hundred percent of the time and of course I've got a thousand questions for you. But you know I was reading something and I just wanted to get into this a little bit. I know you're a cellist with the National Symphony Orchestra but you work with the Metallica bassist Jason Neustadt right? Well that's pretty wild. You know think about it working from working with an orchestra and then working with somebody from Metallica. Now I actually live in in Austin Texas and I'm sure you've probably heard of the Austin Music Festival. The guys that run it see three. One of the good friends of mine actually used to work with them and Metallica decided they were going to do a metal festival out in New Jersey. Well my good friend was working there at the time they were actually breaking everything down after the festival. He had a brain aneurysm and died. And it was terrible. I'll never even forget the phone call I got the day it happened. I was just in shock and of course we all miss Jesse a lot but one of the things I need to tell you about Metallica which I just think to this day they have a special place in my heart. These guys heard about this and of course they didn't know him by any means but they they wanted to donate money they created some money to donate in Jesse's names and ever since then they're always going to have a special place in my heart. So let's talk a little bit about the band you worked with with with him and that was called Echo Brain. So tell us a little bit about that. Well I just love this whole concept. So you know I just this is for me I haven't read as much as I should have but the whole cognitive process of appreciation music is kind of where he started this thing. And to go into the world animal world it's I'm thinking it's so interesting and it makes so much sense to me. Now for you guys that are out there listening and when you hear all this stuff it's going to make you think more. It's making me think more I'm thinking about it all the time the more I listen to it the more I'm thinking about it. Now I've got this crazy dog I bring her up all the time David that's her name is Mabel she's a rescue and I've been thinking ever since I started reading about you and listening and doing all the things that maybe you can write some music for her but I'll get into that later but I don't have a big question for you later but let's get into it. You know music for cats and that's where he started and let's get back all the way to the days of Charles Snowden and I'm just gonna let you go and I'm really really gonna try not to interrupt you but I'm gonna try to hold myself and I even try to bite my tongue. Hey David hey let me just interrupt you for a second. So I did a little research on tamarin monkeys and for you guys that are out there listening they're from Colombia and there's roughly about 6,000 of those in the world right now and they're about one and a half pounds and they kind of look like Einstein they've got this big white thing on the top of their head but also they're the most endangered primate species in the world right now. So I just wanted to add that David go ahead. In your TED talk he talked a little bit about that and one of the things I'm really curious about you're talking about the E flat scale and that how we assume humans were the only things that did E flat scales that I find interesting. So for all those guys out that aren't big speed metal fans so maybe should look at it differently now if you can think of about as a ballot right. So it's kind of like that old saying drunk to me treasure to you. Well so I guess it's just treasure to them right. Well they're cats. So one of the things I read is that when you did the monkey study you had about a 77% accuracy response right. Well I guess what my point really is is that you just really got a real good positive result and then by doing that and having good results it actually caused you to move forward and start doing other things as well. You know they've just developed their own personalities but that's the same thing as humans it's just the same thing. Right that's awesome. Yeah it is. So let's just talk some more about the cats. There's a lot of things I've read and I'm gonna let you get into that stuff but I mean I'm just really interested. So you started developing things for the cats and walk me through the process how you created that and because I know it's different than primates for very specific reasons and I'll let you explain that one. Wow this is fascinating. So cats when they're purring they're purring when they're happy and then they're when they're in pain they're doing similar to like if you have food oh man that's so good and then you hurt oh man that hurts. Wow that makes all the sense in the world. I've actually never heard that. I love this. By the way if you just want to hear the music and catch it you can find it on Spotify but let's just keep going. Now you've created this stuff and so when you're doing it when you're making the music it's really for the most part maybe for like making them more calm calming them down but if there were guests one of the one of the things is really interesting is what you said earlier it was really good for the feral cats and cats that have been abused or have been through some trauma. So I know because we have a lot of rusty people to actually listen to the podcast and you know you get these animals that have been abused so would it be almost like they're getting therapy? So after cats and I'm going to get to the horses for last because God I find it so really really really interesting and some of the new stuff you're doing now but let's start with the dogs. I've been no I know you've been working on that and so where are you in that and let's talk about the problems the successes and all that I'm just really curious. You know somebody had mentioned it at least that you were working on headphones for them and God I thought that was so interesting especially the analogy kind of like Michael Phelps getting ready to win a gold medal race after race in particular I just found that really really interesting. Right well I was really excited about that so you know wait let's let's get back to the dogs a little bit. So have you thought about as an example I had somebody on the show and there are actually a rescue group to get these dogs out of Korea and what they say they're saving them save them from the plate and getting them to homes and to save them from being but wait a minute one of the things that they that you know that they talked about is these dogs are all in crates they're retrievers so they're all the same size they're either labs or golden retrievers and would be interesting to talk to them because it's like what you're talking about the cats the ones that were traumatized are feral these dogs have been in a cage they've been beaten and you know one of the things they do in these dog farms as they raise them they wait they're actually raised from a puppy until they're about one years old before they take them to the restaurants but these they believe that if these dogs are beaten and causes some adrenaline I know this sounds horrible and their cousin drilling to make the meat taste better so if you've got a select group and like you said you've got the feral cats were traumatized and they're traumatized wouldn't that kind of be similar to what you were doing cats and maybe similar to like these dogs that are work with canine warriors that are for the soldiers are going for PTSD I mean it seems to me as a human knowing how music affects me emotionally and whatever mood I am I've got to believe in the possibility well I know the possibilities but thinking of it's a bigger possibility if maybe if you do have this select group or something I mean I know I'm talking to choir but maybe you've already looked into this stuff so basically saying I've actually got a purpose now hey but when we get off I'll give you all the contact information because I'd be thrilled to see something really cool for happen for these animals and of course for the rescue group one thing I mentioned earlier about my dog Mabel now Mabel's a rescue and I don't know she's the craziest dog you've ever seen she's a sweetest ever the most anxious dog I've ever seen I've had her for four years now I've never seen her losing energy I mean she does laps in my backyard I take her out all the time doesn't matter she's gonna do laps in the backyard but you don't know this but I kind of made her my silent partner in the podcast I bring her up all the time and eventually everybody will be listening and we'll get to know her pretty well but I was thinking one of the things I was going to ask you as I mentioned earlier I need to make some music for her because I'll put headphones on her any day if it'll work well I always kind of joke she's a Mexican rat dog she's basically a hind 57 she's a little bit of everything but it was told by the rescue group that she's actually a hound there's a species of the hounds called Pharaoh similar to the Egyptians so but if you look at her she looks like those statues you see in Egypt but you know she's she's a sweet dog I mean it's not that she's not and everybody says well maybe if you gave her CBD of coming down and I just don't want to drug the dog either but again she just she's not at times with me she can be really calm but if anybody shows up my house she goes crazy it's not that she's being mean she's just really happy to seem to the point of fanatical you know she just the sweet dog and you know like here's a good example I feed her all the time she totally knows me she's never been abused by any means for me but if I move my hand fast she shies away so something happened I have zero idea why let me just tell you right now Mabel's too much of a task for everybody I love her to death don't get me wrong but I tell you my entire life I've had animals at one point I had six dogs and a couple cats but I've never ever had a dog like her matter of fact my friends show up this year going crazy days laughing because they know that I'm the one that's got her so they get a pretty funny kick out of her but she's a happy dog she likes attention and she gets all the attention in the world but whatever it is whatever she has you know maybe she's just Mabel oh yeah I mean I mean this woman that runs the rescue group which I actually had an episode with what an amazing person just talked to her and it's just what they're doing is crazy you know I've talked to several of people also that have adopted dogs and foster dogs from these guys and then when you do the research and everything and what they're actually doing over in South Korea and by the way it's just the older generation newer generations it doesn't believe in it and and they're against it as a matter of fact in the government the president the first lady are trying to get some legislation to download but it's a big industry still over there and it's probably about 30% of the population still has it for a meal they've got dog farms that are some of as big as 7,000 dogs basically there's raised like a cattle farm because you really didn't want to know I sure wouldn't want to know either well it's culture thing and you can't blame people for culture you know modern times now you can have some stuff but generally it's the older generation that just that's how they grew up with and they're still living in the past or they're just not living in the future and you know again it's just a culture thing and it is what it is okay one last thing I mentioned to you one of the things I like to do on my podcast I ask our guests if they've got an animal joke and if you have one I'd love you to tell it and if you don't I always have one so do you have one for us no no I love all jokes and you know what though it just speaks to human nature really sometimes it just all comes down to communication right absolutely you know you've got to listen and communicate both I mean the other day I had a conversation my daughter and she's having some stuff going on with work and I was trying to explain to her it did it all everything comes down to communications you've got to learn how to communicate because that's usually where the problems break down and because it's all about communications and that's exactly what you're doing you're teaching these animals you're communicating with them so that they feel better and so really first of all just let me tell you this thank you so much for being on here I mean in so many ways I just was excited just to get to meet you because I just think what you're doing is an amazing thing and I'm sure everybody out there too for real will really appreciate we've said and now if you're if you want to listen to some more about what David he's got some TED talks online you can I'm gonna have that on social media you can also find him on Spotify to listen to the music you know music for cats he's got that on there but also if you've got a good joke and I always try to tell everybody this and you want to be on the show you're gonna send it in to my email in Kyle at for real podcast calm it's MK YLE to ours for real podcast calm and let's let us know what it is we'll record it and it can be you your children whatever we just want to have you on the show so if you want an opportunity to show just tell me a joke and we'll get it out there most importantly David thank you so much and everybody thank you so much for real and everybody have a great day take care now and thank you oh thank you so much I just really really appreciate everything and I'm so glad I got to meet you and I'm I'm telling you right now we're gonna keep in touch take care