Q7-19890426-Larry_Rosenberg-UNK-conscious_breathing_i_reflections_on_anapanasati_i-1566 Leandra Teje

Talk: 19890426-Larry_Rosenberg-UNK-conscious_breathing_i_reflections_on_anapanasati_i-1566 Leandra Tejedor Start_time: 00:41:50 Display_question: I am confused about where I should follow the breath; the abdomen or the nostrils? Keyword_search: abdomen, nostril, meditation, Burmese, attention, sensations, samadhi, image of saw, jhanas, piti, sukha, ekaggata, one-pointedness, Anapanasati Sutta, awareness, suffering Question_content: Questioner: I've been following the abdomen for a long time. Larry: You're an abdomen man. Yeah. Questioner: And every time this subject comes up about, whether we should follow the breath at the nose, or the abdomen, seems to be, well, just where you're following, just continue to follow it. Now… Larry: I'm not saying that, am I? Questioner: Do I hear you to say tonight that the focus on the nostril is a quicker way to say… Larry: Yes, you do hear me say that. It's not democratic. I'm not saying just hang out wherever you want to be, it's all okay. But let me limit that. It's basically what I mentioned. Take a look at the abdomen. It's much broader. Again, it's just like the whole breath or the chest. They're perfectly good places to be, and finally it'll be, is it working for you? If it is, for goodness sake, stay there. Don't become a professor of comparative meditation techniques. If you're drawn to it, and you have an affinity for it, just stay there, and just in one ear, and out the other ear, whatever I was saying here. By in large though, and this has been my experience, because I've also spent a lot of time here, if you work with Burmese teachers, that's where often they'll… it's a larger area, and it has certain advantages, just as the whole breath does. But when you can develop, you see… Break_line: For example, what I was referring to, is not in a sense even following the breath, it's stationing your attention, let's say at the nostrils, or the upper lip, and experiencing the in breath, the sensations produced by the breath coming in, and coming out. You're not moving. It's not like you're moving with the breath, at that point you're just stationary, and you feel the sensations, as they come and go. If there are no sensations, you're still there in that region. Break_line: The image that the ancient commentators’ uses of a saw, let's say, here's some wood, and there's one piece that you put the saw on. You don't have to follow the saw. You don't have to go here, and then there, and here, and there. It's where the teeth of the saw touch, just one point on the wood. That's what gives it the power, to cut through the wood. And so, the image here is, it's not that you're following the breath this way, that was step one and two. And again, it's all useful. Don't ever set any of these up against the others. That's the mistake. It's not political, anyway. Break_line: So you're at this point… now, in the samadhi practice…let me very quickly sketch out the way the early jhanas come about. First, you have to aim your attention at the object, whether it's the breath, or whatever it is, that's number one. Then you have to stick with the object. If the degree to which you're able to stick to the object produces piti, piti grows into sukha. sukha grows into ekaggata. one pointedness, where the mind, where awareness, resides in itself. It's just pure awareness, with no objects. Break_line: Now, what I am saying is, that based on my own experience, and based on obviously it's the bias of the particular teachers I've worked with, and the commentaries, that I've that I've studied, although the basic ones that everyone has access to, nothing special about it. Overwhelmingly, this is what is thought can get you there more quickly. But now if you greedily start doing that, you have another problem, a new way to suffer. So now what are you going to do, Murray? You're going to say the tummy or the nose? Are you going to be a… Questioner: For years you used to say it didn't matter. Larry: It doesn't matter for certain things, but for this, what I'm saying is, this can be helpful. Yeah. Remember here's something not to forget. I'm talking about the Anapanasati Sutta. So, you know, it's not just general. I'm not…in other words, this is the way this sutra unfolds. Can you see the difference? If we weren't doing this, it's a little bit different. But really, where do you want to be? I'm not trying to be a wise guy. Questioner: (inaudible) Larry: Okay great. End_time: 00:46:07