Ep. 4 Anxiety Talk

The podcast discusses how anxiety for teens is more openly discussed in society now compared to the past. The hosts share personal experiences of their family members dealing with anxiety. They also talk about different types of anxiety, such as social anxiety and performance anxiety. They discuss how quarantine during COVID-19 may have contributed to social anxiety in teenagers. They touch on the challenges of dealing with anxiety, including panic attacks and finding ways to cope. The hosts also recount a specific incident where one of them experienced a panic attack at school and how they tried to help. Hey guys and welcome back to the Off Topic Podcast. Today I am here with my friend Emerson and we're going to be talking about anxiety for teens and how our society is way more open about it than how it used to be. Like for my mom, for example, I know she has anxiety and my grandma too, and it was like not spoken about at all back in the day. I don't know if it's the same case for you if you know. Does your mom have anxiety? Yeah, and she it's she's not like her mom didn't let her speak of it, not let her speak of it but like if she spoke of it, it'd be like, you're fine, you're fine. Okay, yeah, yeah, that's how yeah, it was basically like that back then. And now I think it's very like, well, I don't I wouldn't say it's very normalized now because still even I have a hard time like thinking that it's normal myself, but I'd say it's a lot more normalized than it used to be. And like my grandma, for example, she has anxiety too. And she, I think she's like against it herself. Like she doesn't believe she has it. And she like doesn't want to get the help she needs, which she does need help. But she just I don't know, it's just like different because that's what I grew up knowing that it was like, not normalized and kind of weird, I guess. But anyway, so we'll start by talking about the different types of anxiety. I don't know all of them. I just know like a few. I know I myself have social anxiety, and performance anxiety. And you have social anxiety. So I've been told that I have general anxiety, social anxiety, separation anxiety, and panic disorder. But as of right now, I think it's just more panic disorder. Okay, because general anxiety, I used to have general anxiety, like when I was like, much, much younger, like elementary school, like, you know, when you like worry about things like all the yeah, like, now I don't really think like, oh, I'm like stress. I don't worry about little things. Like, when I was younger, I used to have like these little worry dolls. Yeah. And I told you this, I think every night, I would, like, wish each one I'd be like, Oh, I hope there's not a fire when I'm sleeping. I hope I don't someone doesn't kidnap me when I'm sleeping and stuff like that. So like 20 different dolls. So I used to worry, but now I don't worry that much. So now it's just you think, yes, panic disorder? Yeah. Not even social anxiety? No. I mean, I have like, fear of public speaking. I can get over that. But that's it. Well, yeah, me personally, I have social anxiety and performance anxiety because of dance. Like when I, I don't dance anymore. But when I did, I had like severe performance anxiety. And it kind of came out of nowhere, to be honest, like I used to not. And then all of a sudden, I just like, started, like freaking out about performing. And it became kind of a hassle for me. And that's kind of why I quit because it was just like, it wasn't worth it in the end. But then I got I didn't even have social anxiety either growing up, I only kind of started getting that during COVID because of quarantine. And I think a lot like that happened to a lot of teens were during like quarantine, they got social anxiety and just uncomfortable with being in public because we were in our rooms and in our homes, like for a whole year. And we like, missed out on all those social experiences and stuff like that. So that's kind of when I started getting social anxiety around then, like four, three, four years ago. Yeah, I still I don't know really about performance anxiety anymore, because I don't dance. So I don't like perform. But I think I still do like if I were to perform, but I definitely still have social anxiety. Um, how do you? I don't know how to word this. But how do you like, deal with your social anxiety? Not sorry, you don't feel that either. How do you kind of deal with your anxiety during like school? Because I know you used to get like, panic attacks and stuff during school. Okay, well, obviously, now that I've started medication, that helps a lot. But before, there wasn't really a way for me to deal with it. Like, I didn't know how to deal with it before. So like, I just, it would just come out of nowhere. And I just like had to accept it. I mean, I try to like, calm myself down. But that obviously did not help. So I usually talk to people that I know can calm me down. Like if you don't know anything about anxiety, and I'm in the middle of a panic attack, that's gonna stress me out more. Because if something's happening to me, I don't know. And like, neither does the person that's trying to help me. But now that I'm on medication, it's obviously calmed down the panic attacks. But after doing therapy and stuff like that, I've learned ways to like, stop the panic attack from happening. Like, if I feel it coming on, like now I can tell when it's coming on, I could tell that now I feel anxious. And now I can talk myself out of it. And they didn't, they didn't only happen in school, did they? They happened out of school too? Or? Yeah, but not as school was worse. But outside of school, yeah. But there was never like, when it's outside of school, there's no reason for it. It just happened. Yeah. At school, there was always a reason. No. Yes. Sometimes there was reasons and sometimes there wasn't. Yeah. Yeah, well, I was gonna, like what you were talking about before, people that don't know how to deal with it. Like for me, when I first started witnessing your panic attacks, I wasn't, I wasn't scared, because like, for now, I kind of just know, like panic attacks are normal. And I would just kind of like, do my best to calm you down. But I also didn't know exactly what to do. Right. But I wanted to help you like everything. Like, I just wanted to give my power to like, calm you down and help you because I didn't want you to like feel like this. But it's also hard because I didn't, I don't have the right like, like, I'm not a therapist. I'm not like, I'm not like specialized in this. So it's like, me kind of witnessing it. I was like, I just wasn't really sure what to do. What was like your view on it? Like, what did I look like? Like, because I don't know what I Yeah, I'm, um, I honestly, at first, I was like, because the first time I remember witnessing one of these was in sec one. No, not sec one. What year was it when you went outside? And it was like the glove thing that was like, Okay, I think that was like the first time I ever witnessed it. So um, I was young, you were young, and it wasn't like something I had kind of ever seen before. So it was a bit I was a bit weirded out. But also, I wanted to like kind of do everything I could to help. And I do remember when we finally got in school. I think you should give context on like what happened. If you want. Yeah, okay. Well, I don't even really remember fully. I remember. It was like, you couldn't go to school without a mask. Yeah, this is a COVID year. Yeah. And I was like, our yard, my mask, I left my mask on the other side of the yard. And like, the bell already rang. And I was like, or rung, whatever. And I was like, stressing because I was like, still like sec two. Yeah, you don't want to be like late for class at that point. And then after everyone, like, there was nobody in the schoolyard anymore. Besides me and Kaylee were left. And I forgot my mask. And then I asked you to go get it with me. But you said no, you're like, I don't want to be late. That sort of freaking me out even more because I couldn't go into school without a mask. So then I started like crying. And you saw that I was trying to stay safe. And then I'm running across that field and running back. And I didn't really watch you. Yeah, I was like, already hyperventilating from like, trying to run across the field. So that just like started it off and then just went downhill from there. Yeah, I don't even remember. I don't remember. I blanked out. Like, I have no idea what happened. I didn't blank out. It's just been so long. But I know that we once we finally got in school, we didn't go to class because she was already like panicking. So I was like, okay, we're not going to class. Like, we'll go find help. But also, you never really wanted help at the same time. Like you wanted help, but not like from a teacher. Like, I don't know, I guess there was a certain, was there a certain teacher that you were fine with? Well, like, at the end of the year, in sec two, no, there wasn't. Yeah. And that's why like me, my little 12 year old or 13 year old self was like, we need help. Like, let's get a teacher because I didn't know what to do. Right. So I was also like, panicking, but trying to like, stay calm. But yeah, so then we ended up being like, right in front of the office outside. And then we were like, waiting, because the teacher had like, noticed and she was like, trying to like find someone, I guess, to come help us. But while we were waiting outside, I was trying to like, distract you from like, getting in your head and like, keep thinking about it. So I was like, asking you, like, Oh, name three colors that you see. I don't even know why I said that. But I was like, No, no, it was the aid, the aid came, they found the aid, and she was asking me questions to distract myself. Oh, so I didn't do that? No, you were there, though. And I remember you laughed after, but I don't remember. Like, three colors and where? Okay, yeah, she did, but I was trying to distract you at first. I do remember that. I think I was just like, talking. I don't know. It wasn't like, that three colors thing. That was the aid, because she actually does what she's doing. And I didn't. But I do remember trying to distract you. Like, we were talking about something else. I don't remember what we were talking about. But yeah. So what was like, your point of view of my panic test last week? Like, what did I look like? Like, I don't know how to explain what I'm trying to ask. But like, well, you look like you're having a panic attack. Yeah, but yeah, you like, the most like, you know, like, moments were like, the most you could kind of tell, like, there's moments where like, I'm shaking, but then there's moments like I blackout, not blackout, but like, I'm not as aware of what's happening. Like, what do I look like in those moments? Well, the moments where you're like, right before it's happening, where you're kind of like, like, can we leave? Or like, can we go for a walk? Like, you kind of like, give me a little signal or warning. Those moments, I like, I'm like, already mentally preparing myself. I'm like, okay, what am I going to do? What am I going to say? And you, you still look fine. Like, you don't look like stressed. Well, you do look stressed, but you don't look like that bad yet. But you, like, you know, what's going to happen to right? So you're like, already like, trying to warn yourself at the same time. And then when you're, I know the times where you're like, hands have been numb, which is kind of like the worst part for you, I guess. Or when I don't know if that's the worst part. But it does like make it worse. And you start freaking out about that. You I don't know if you noticed, but you do like, do this, like, I'm trying to like, scrunch my fingers into my hands right now. And you can't see but that's I'm doing like, yeah, you do that. It's like a lot, like a lot. I never, I never knew that I did this, like a lot, like, like, every second, basically, you're just going like this, trying to like, like, feel them again, because you kind of like lost feeling in your hands. Um, I'd say, I don't know what other kind of symptoms. Like, like, when I'm done, I don't know how to explain it. Like, all I know when I have panic attacks, I mean, every single one's different. Sometimes it starts with like, my hand going numb. Sometimes it starts with my eyesight gone. Yeah, those are the two main ones. And usually when it happens. So I'll just say what like a panic attack is like for me. So basically, it starts with my hands going numb or my eyes, losing vision, like my peripheral vision is gone. And then my hand starts numb, it goes up my arm. And then sometimes I can either my like, I cannot speak anymore, like my, like, there's a part in your brain that like, doesn't, like register when you're when you're like, too nervous. And like, I can't form words, like I know what I want to say in my brain, but I can't say it out loud. Yeah, I wouldn't have thought before. Yeah. Or I get like, my throat, like, feels like it's closing or like, I'm trying to think of what else happened. So I know there's more. But yeah, and like, obviously, uncontrollably shaking, like, yeah, stop it. And I can't speak. I think that's the part where it's like, really, like, that's when I'm like, super nervous. Like, if I can't speak, because like, imagine not being able to speak, but knowing what you want to say. Yeah, it's very frustrating. Yeah. Yeah. So I know when you're like, I don't know if it's not when you're able to speak or whatever. But just, I kind of like overall, whenever I'm trying to like, talk to you, or like, get you to like, do things, ask me if you want water, do you want food? Can you help? Do you want a teacher? You always just say no to everything. You're just like, no, you need to shake your head. I don't even know if you like, do that on purpose, or you just genuinely don't want anything. You just like, I think I just like, can't focus on something else right now. Like, that's always on my mind. What do you want in that situation? Besides, obviously, for it to go away? You want to just be home? No, because my parents also don't know what to do. I just want it to be over. Like, I don't want anything. I just want to lay there. And like, I just want to lay down, like, in silence, but with someone. Yeah, I want someone to be with me. It's honestly all I want. But obviously, sometimes, talking to teachers, but you have to know what you're doing. Yeah, you do. And you have to be a type of person that doesn't cause me stress. Because I think I get into like, I think I want to speak to a teacher, and then they stress me out, and I don't want to speak to them anymore. Like, I know our old vice principal, I can't say her name, but she used to be a vice principal, and now she's just a teacher. Oh, yeah. She, you used to not want to speak to her, but then you did at one point. Yeah. What was that? Did something change? You just got to know her better? Like, do you prefer speaking to teachers you're closer with? Yeah, but I didn't want to speak to her, because she always calls my parents, and I don't want to go home. But then I wanted, more at the end, I wanted to speak to her, because there was like, I'd like wait till there's nothing more I could do. And it's like, now I act, I know I need help, I need someone to help me. And that's when I'll go up to the teacher and ask for help. But I remember the last time, this time, you weren't there, that time with Kayla. Yeah. And I was, a pentecost started, I don't know what happened, how did it start. But I was with Kayla, and I asked to go. Oh, my parents were coming to pick me up, because I was not feeling well, but they were taking too long. And I was like, starting to stress out even more. And I went to, my arm had turned purple, like all of a sudden, one arm was purple, one arm was not. And I ran to the Miss Jones, our vice principal. And I went to go ask, like get help. And she wasn't there. And there was like, nothing, no one could help me. And I literally told my friend that was with me at the time. And I was like, like, we can't just wait here, like something's happening to my arm. Yeah, I thought I was gonna have to go to the hospital. That's always my fear, like that. Yes, my body's gonna like, I'm gonna faint. Shut down. Yeah. Yeah. So I ran to another teacher I know, I knew that can help me and ran and I was like, crying that why is my arm purple? And he ended up putting me in a classroom with nobody and brought an aid in and it all got solved. Yeah, yeah. That's never happened before. That was the first time that happened. Yeah, I just don't know what to do in those situations. Like I kind of gotten better with it, I think. But I also I don't know what to do either. So I can't even tell you what to do. Is it like, am I like, okay, being with you? Yeah, because I know you don't want someone to be with me, I would say I wouldn't ask for help in the first place. Yeah. I feel like in that situation, it's okay to say back away. I need space. Yeah. You obviously I mean, it hurts. Like if someone told me that I'd be like, oh, like I'd be hurt. Yeah, I know. It's like they can't control it. Like when I tell if I tell someone that it's like, honestly, like, I like I'm not ready. Yeah. Honestly, if you told me that I would not really care. Yeah, it's like I'm not I'm focusing on myself right now. I'm trying to stop this. Like I'm not focusing on hurting. I'm not trying to hurt you. And the whole reason why I want to help you in the first place is like for like the best for you. And I want like, yeah, everything to stop. So if you want me to leave, and it's gonna help and I'll leave for sure. Yeah. But some people I can't say, yeah. I just don't like when I'm surrounded by a lot of people. Yeah. The whole reason why I started talking about school in the beginning, though, is because it's kind of an awkward place to have situations. And is that like, a lot of other students being around? Is that like, make it worse? And you like, don't want them to see kind of? Yeah, I don't want them to see because I don't like attention. Yeah, just school. I don't know. School is not a stressful place for me. Yeah, I don't think it's like, I'm not stressed when I thought of school. Yeah. But I'm stressed of having a panic attack there. And there's no one there to help me. But I guess before it was different because I had no help. Like, now I have medication to calm me down. If that were to happen, if it gets too crazy, like, there's actually something that's going to help me. Yeah. Like, could potentially help me or like, it's going to stop the panic attack. So that's, obviously, that's why I think the panic attacks have stopped this year. Because I know there's something I could rely on at school with me at all times. Yeah. But before there wasn't like, like, I never knew when it was gonna end. I never knew when it was gonna start. Who was gonna help me? What was the situation going on? And I need to know like, everything before it happens. Like, I need to be able to picture everything. Yeah. To not be stressed. And I can't picture everything in that situation. I can't even think for myself. Yeah. Did they start during high school or before? Before, they were, I guess when you just have normal anxiety, like, hyperventilate, you know, that type of thing. But my first ever panic attack was in sec two. Okay. And I don't know, you want me to share the story? Yeah, of course. So basically, I was in the lab, and I didn't feel well. And there was like, all the smells from like, the aprons and stuff. So I thought like, the chemicals were gonna get into me. Okay, yeah. Like, something was gonna happen. And they also, it was the first time they like, showed us that if something happens, you have to go into the shower. Oh, yeah. So that really freaked me out. Yeah, when I first heard that, I was stressed, not gonna lie. And then I was not feeling, like, I felt really sick. So the science teacher, who was a sub at the time, told me to come downstairs and sit at the office. And that's what I did. And I sat at the office. And then I, the principal, or vice principal at the time, gave me a mug of water to drink. And I was sitting by myself in the hallway. And all of a sudden, I could not swallow the water. My tongue was like, I don't know what happened. But my mouth was like, numb. I couldn't swallow. I couldn't, like, nothing. So I went in, and I was trying to tell the secretary something's happening. But she didn't understand. Like, she knew something was wrong. So she got the vice principal. Yeah. And I went in there, and I could not speak. My legs were like, shaking. And he knew what to do, because apparently his sister, like, had anxiety. But, like, it was the first time I was never able to speak for myself, which really, like... Well, it was also your first big panic attack. Yeah. So it was all new. And then I gave him, like, a hand signal to write. Like, I was, like, trying to show him that I wanted to write something. So he got me a pen and paper, and I tried to pick up the pen, and I could not pick up the pen, which got me even more stressed. There was, like, no way for me to communicate. Like, I thought I was gonna have to go to the hospital. And, like, my body was breaking down. Like... Yeah. Like, my brain was, like... Yeah, but even when you're in... When you're in, like, a panic attack, you just keep thinking the worst, and your brain keeps spiraling, and that's kind of what a whole panic attack is, that you just can't stop thinking about the worst. Yeah. And basically after that, I had gone home eventually, and I ended up throwing up multiple times. And, yeah, that's what happened. So you felt better after? Yeah. Like, the minute I throw up, I'm fine after. Yeah. That was me with my performance anxiety. Yeah. Like, if it gets really bad for me, and I feel nauseous, I want to throw up. Or, like, I've also noticed at school, a lot of times, this is... Especially last year, and I'm sure you noticed this, like, eventually the panic attacks started happening, like, every day at the same time. I remember one week where it happened, I think, three times a week. Yeah, and it was... And it happened at the same time every day, and the minute I ate, it was fine. And my doctor told me she doesn't think those are panic attack symptoms. And there's also, like, a lot of times I think of, like, it's not low sugar or whatever, but I don't remember exactly what it is, but a lot of times when that happens to your body, you have symptoms that are the same as a panic attack. Yeah. So that also was happening at the same time. So not only did I have a panic attack, but I was, like, needed to eat, and my levels were low, so I was making it worse. So, yeah. Yeah. So school... It's not, like, the worst place, I guess, because there's people to help and me to help, but... But, yeah, I don't know. I kind of thought that, like, if I ever... I don't know, I've never... Well, I've only ever once had a panic attack in my whole life. Just once. And I don't think I'd want that to happen in school. That, I guess, is different for everyone. And you're... I don't know. But, yeah. I just also wish... This is, like, off-topic. It's okay. But I find, like, today, anxiety is, like, a very loose term, and I've told you this before. Yeah. Like, anytime people feel a little bit of stress, they're, like, I haven't... Oh, I'm, like... Like, they think normal worrying is anxiety, and it's not. Like, everyone worries. Everyone gets stressed. It's, like, a normal human thing you're meant to be. Yeah, that's just stress. Yeah. Stress is normal. And a lot of times, people now say, oh, I'm... A lot of people now say, like, oh, I'm going to have a panic attack over this, and they're not. So, I don't really like when they say that. Yeah. But... What was I going to say? I also find that... I forgot what I was going to say. But, yeah, no, the whole thing about that, like... Loose term? Well, yeah, what I was saying at, like, the beginning, beginning, how it's, like, normalized, I think it's, like, normalized, but in the wrong way. I think people are thinking, like, like, everyone has anxiety. Yeah, like, they don't realize how big of a deal it really is. Yeah. Like, it's, like, not like a one-hundred-blue-moon-I'm-stressed. It's, like, a day-to-day thing. Yeah. So, yeah, that's... I don't get it. I think, honestly, social media has had a big impact on that, and because, like, everything is being shared so much now, and, like, everyone's lives are just out there, and kind of when you see someone, like, with something or having something, you kind of assume that you have it, too. Like... Wait, I don't know what I'm saying, but, like, you know when, like, you see... Like, for example, when you're, like, this is just really random, but when you're, like, like, something's, like, happening to your body, like, I don't know if you have a sore throat, and you, like, Google it online, and then it's, like, you have cancer. Like, no, that's not the case, but then it's the same thing online, where you see all these things, and these people are, like, oh, there's this, I have this symptoms, and then they're, like, they're kind of, like, self-diagnosing themselves, which is wrong. You should not self-diagnose, and I think because of social media, a lot of people do that, but anxiety is also just a more common thing now. Like, I feel like it's, like, the highest, like, it's at the peak right now, the amount of people that have anxiety, and, um, I don't know how to explain this, but I don't want, like, when I'm, like, I'm not shy to share my anxiety, because I know a lot of people have it, and won't speak up about it. Like, teachers tell you all the time, well, just, everyone says all the time, like, anxiety's common, like, you're not alone, everyone has it, but then there's times where you're, like, because nobody shares, it seems like you're the only one who has it, and even, like, when I did have those vice principal panic attacks, I had asked the vice principal, like, have you ever seen this happen, and she's, like, no, and considering you're a vice principal, and, like, how many students are in this class, I feel like you would have seen it, but a lot of people hide it, which is why I think people get more insecure about it, but to me, I'm not, like, if I'm gonna become pregnant with you, you have to know that I have anxiety, because it's such a big thing in your life, and if something happens, I don't want you to, like, freak out as well, like, what's happening to her, like, you need to know what's happening, because it can happen out of nowhere. Yeah, like, when I first began pregnancy, you told me, but I didn't realize how big it was until I actually witnessed it. There's also the thing where it's, like, you can know up until a certain point until you actually, like, witness it and experience it. Yeah, and I just want more people to be open about it, like, I don't think there's a reason to be scared. There's obviously a reason to be scared about it, but in my, for me, there's no reason for me to be scared about it, because I enjoy talking about it, and I enjoy telling people how I feel about it and sharing. Yeah, and there's also the thing where it's, like, everyone has anxiety in a different way, and there's, like, the different types, too, so it's, like, it is different, but then there's also some people that you will relate to in a way. Yeah. Like, I don't relate to you in anxiety the same way at all, like, our anxiety is very different, but it's still, like, still to a certain point where I'm, like, okay, she also has anxiety at the same time, you know, like, it's just, like, because I used to struggle with not believing that other, like, people, like, went through what I went, like, what I kind of go through, and my anxiety is, like, nowhere near as bad as yours. I'm just having social anxiety, but I used to think that I was, like, weird for having social anxiety, like, because, like, ordering or, like, talking to people, not talking to, like, I'm fine talking to people, but, like, just, like, social anxiety, I just can't, like, I can't, like, speak to people sometimes, and I can't order, I can't ask questions, and it's, like, I don't know why I can't, like, it just seems like such a normal thing, and, like, I don't know, like, why can't I do this, but it is very normal, and when I first started speaking with my therapist, like, two, three years ago, she had to, like, explain how a lot of other people go through this, and that you're not alone, and, like, I know it's spoken about a lot more than it was back then, but it's still not as, like, like, what you were saying, like, people need to still be talking about it more, and in the right way, without doing it, like, how social media does it, and kind of, I don't know, I kind of feel like it's being glorified a little, like, anxiety, like, I think, I feel like people kind of, like, want to have it, like, but that's also to do with, like, wanting attention and stuff, but I think that, that, I used to be, not that I used to want anxiety, but I used to want, like, if you don't have attention on you, you're obviously going to want something that's going to draw attention to you, or I wanted glasses, like, now that I have glasses, now that I know, like, I used to, when I was younger, and, like, had anxiety, I felt like, because I wasn't crying, or because I wasn't hyperventilating, you, they weren't, I wasn't taking seriously that I was not ready to do whatever it is, like, for a presentation, I was not ready, but if I didn't cry, if I didn't, like, freak out, I feel like they wouldn't take me seriously, and they forced me to do it, so, I used to wish, like, why can't you just, like, actually freak out, and now that I actually do it, I would take anything to not ever have anxiety, like, to me, someone who doesn't have anxiety, that's just so bizarre to me, like, how do you, like, you must have, like, yeah, and how do you just live life without worrying, like, that's just so crazy to me, that there's people out there who just, like, are, like, do whatever they want, they just don't care, like, extroverts, like, how, how is it possible that this person's freaking out about this, like, this is, like, what, why are you freaking out, like, calm down, I wish everyone could experience, at least once in their life, what I experienced, so just understand, like, I'm not just, like, being dramatic, yeah, oh, 100%, I, like, definitely not, I don't think you're being dramatic at all, and that's, like, it's also, like, so, anxiety's not, like, something to joke about, too, like, you need to be serious about it, and, yeah, my last thing is how to deal with anxiety, and it's a very, it's a very broad and kind of hard question to answer, but I was wondering if you have any of your own little strategies, I know you do take medication, so there's that, but that's, like, I haven't figured it out myself how to deal with anxiety, but therapy, obviously, is a big one, the biggest thing that I've realized out of all my whole journey with anxiety is that if you're not willing to accept the help and willing to realize you have anxiety, and, like, it's, anxiety's not curable, like, there's ways to manage it so that you don't have it, but you will always have anxiety, so I think the biggest thing I've realized is you need to want help you need to accept it, you can get told, I need to go, you need to go to a therapist, but if you don't want to do it, it's not going to work, and that's what happened to me, I've been to multiple therapists, and I never want to do it, and it doesn't work, and then, I don't know why, randomly, it just clicked in my head, but I wanted help, and I wanted this to go away, and I, and it did, the minute I started therapy, everything got better, obviously, I'm on medication, so that plays a big part in not being as anxious anymore, but I don't view it as, like, oh, I have pills that stop my anxiety, because, and this is what my therapist told me, but, basically, my, I don't know exactly what it is that's unbalanced, but I have, like, a chemical, or whatever, a hormone, that's unbalanced compared to everybody else's, and that's what causes the panic attacks, and medication just levels your hormones, or whatever it is, to make it all equal, so that's just how I view it now, and you have to accept the help for it to go away, so, and strategy-wise, I used to hate the breathing exercises, but now, like, I tell all my therapists, I hate breathing exercises, like, do not make me meditate, because I'm not going to do it, but, honestly, breathing exercises is what helps the most for me, like, four, it's like the square method, so, four seconds breathing in, four seconds holding, four seconds breathing out, four seconds holding it, that's helped the most, and also, the most difficult to do, and I still struggle to do it, is talking yourself out of it, like, realizing nothing's happening, like, if I'm anxious, I should never be able to do this, but if I'm anxious, I have to, like, play out everything that's happening right now, so, let's say I randomly get anxious in my room, and I have to tell myself, you are in your room, nothing is happening, you are literally watching YouTube, or watching a movie, you're perfectly fine, there are people to help you, and that's the hardest part, because you talk yourself out of it, and then you feel a symptom, and you're like, oh, my God, like, it's not gone, but that's, learning how to do that is, like, I think, helps me the most, because now, I still have the start of panic attacks, but I'm able to stop it, because I can talk myself out of it, and before, I never knew how to do that, and that was, like, what made it worse, like, I thought, like, you're going to the hospital, and it just kept spiraling, yeah, that is a big thing, yeah, I've been told about the breathing exercises, too, and I hated those, and even recently, I saw my therapist, like, I don't know, a couple, like, a week ago, I think, I was telling her about how I don't see the point of, like, that sounds weird, not just breathing normally, because you need to breathe, but I don't see the point in breathing exercises, and then, she was, like, telling me how, like, it's not about seeing the point in it, but it's about realizing how, like, scientifically, it actually calms your body down, and, like, breathing slowly, and then we did this activity where I was, like, crunched up in a ball, and trying to, like, with my head down, and trying to breathe slowly, and it's harder than when you're, like, all straight up and relaxed, and then, yeah, I don't know, she was just kind of explaining how, like, it really does help, even if, like, you don't think it does, and, like, I kind of understand now that even if I don't realize it's going to help, it does, because scientifically, it does help, yeah, and then there's also about the whole talking yourself out of it, this is more with my performance anxiety, because with that, I would spiral a lot, and just keep thinking about the worst in those situations that I was in, and, yeah, I don't know, it was just, I don't think I ever really like, understood that, or mastered that, and then I quit dance, so, don't know if that's ever going to happen again, but the whole talking yourself out of it is definitely a challenge, and something to work on, but I'm glad you got that done. But, yeah, overall, anxiety is just, it is normal, and it needs to be talked about more, which is why I'm glad we did this episode, because I thought it was fun talking about it, and, I don't know, you just learn more when you talk about it with other people, and share their own experiences, and it's good. Alright, well, thank you guys for listening. That was fun. See you next time.