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Financial literacy is the topic of discussion on the podcast Mealtime. The hosts explore what financial literacy means and its importance. They speak to people in the community who share their thoughts and opinions on the topic. An expert in sociology also gives insights into how budgeting affects poverty levels and the need for financial literacy education in schools. The expert believes that teaching financial literacy can help decrease stress levels and break intergenerational patterns of wealth inequality. They suggest offering classes on financial literacy in high school and providing access to financial advisors for those who need it. Welcome to the podcast Mealtime, brought to you by Elizabeth, Allie, Louise, and Marissa. And at the dinner table, we're going to be discussing what is financial literacy and how the education system has filled us into understanding financial literacy at a deeper level. We're going to start by taking a listen to people around us in the community and see what they think and their thoughts on financial literacy and what it is. And then we'll hear an expert's opinion to give us insight onto financial literacy and we'll even hear from a personal story and narrative experience on financial literacy. Then we'll finally all come back to the dinner table and discuss the food and our thoughts on it. Now, let's go out into the community and see what people have to say. What is financial literacy? I'm not sure. I'm guessing financial literacy is the knowledge of being financially stable. One is knowledgeable in the field of finances. I guess when it comes to mine, I don't know entirely what it is, but I would think like this. Understanding what financial stuff means with money and like retirement and like housing and stuff like that. It's pretty much just the handling of money and understanding of how to handle money and deal with money. You need to be taught in school, no matter what, because... But it's never going to be taught in school because the government knows that we're going to be broke no matter what and they're going to fool us because we're just cash cows for them. Probably be setting aside a budget and understanding how much money you bring in and how much money you spend at the end of the month. We're going to check and see what's the first thing that comes to their mind when they think of financial literacy. Okay, so what is the first thing that comes to your mind when you think of financial literacy? I think of debt. I mean, financial has to do with money and literature, so I'm just thinking like the aspect of spending money. I think the first thing that kind of comes to my mind is thinking about like budgeting and being responsible with your money. I think of knowing how to work with your money and how to use it efficiently. What I think of is the knowledge of budgeting, saving, and investing. First thing that comes to mind has to be like investments. Mine is splitting your money into three different ways for one's needs and for others, for personal use. So for me, like I said, it's data, cash, analyzing, financial stability. Savings account, you know, put your bank, put your money aside where you can't see it. Basically how you decide to spend your money or like savings, basically how you want to keep more money in the long run. To me, I think financial literacy is like using terms, data, analyzing. It's like for the broader, how do you say, it's just like better terms to explain the financial situation to people, right? Financial literacy is the ability to understand and apply different financial skills effectively. I guess when I think of financial literacy, it's probably like having, I'd say, a deep understanding of like where your money goes. From what I gathered, I think that financial literacy means basically making informed decisions with your money. Now that we've heard about financial literacy from people in the community around us, it's time to take a listen to an expert's opinion on financial literacy and its effects. What is your full name? Catherine Rexan Medrano. Okay, and what are your degrees in? I have a BA in Sociology and Ethnic Studies. And a Master's in Sociology. And how long have you been teaching Sociology? I have been teaching Sociology for about 13 years. Okay. One question I would like to ask you first is how does budgeting affect the poverty levels in Sociology? You know, I think that sometimes people think that, oh, people who are poor, like they just don't have good budgeting skills, right? And that somehow encourages them to be in poverty or maybe because, like sometimes people will critique people and say like, oh, like you really can't afford that car or you should not be wearing those shoes, right? And that's what's really, it's just their, they have bad financial planning and that's what's causing poverty. But poverty really comes from these larger systemic issues in terms of like wages, you know, the housing market, how much you have to pay for food, for inflation. So there's all these other economic factors that really play into it. But what I will say is that for people who are poor, budgeting, right, definitely, I mean, it's harder. There's a lot more stress and it can be much more crucial, right? Like especially if you're on a limited budget, you have to think about am I going to pay the rent or am I going to buy food right now, right? And so if possible, it would be great if people, you know, had the capacity to save. But, you know, I mean, and regardless, like in America, whether you're poor or whether you're rich, like 90% of Americans don't have anything in their savings account anyways, right? And so it's really a luxury if you don't have to budget and you still have enough money at the end of the day. Yeah. Do you feel like education systems should be better on touching on the 50-30-20 topic? For like credit? Like financial structure? I think that definitely the educational system, it would be beneficial for everybody if they taught more financial literacy. But in sociology, right, so like a major theory within sociology is conflict theory and conflict theory really looks at how, you know, social institutions are manipulated by the elite in our society to maintain the status quo. So even though it may be in like the general population's interest to learn about financial literacy, it doesn't really help, you know, credit card companies or, you know, these people who are managing credit because really they can prey off of people when they're not financially literate. Yeah. Do you think and would see stress levels decrease as a society if students in high school, college, etc., were taught financial literacy? Absolutely. I think that that would help relieve stress levels, right? To just know that you have some sense of control and that you know how to make the best kinds of decisions. I think when people don't know and they don't know where, you know, how they're going to pay their next bill, they don't know where the money is coming from, I mean, that not only can cause stress for the individual, but it can cause stress for the family, for their partner relationships with their kids. What do you as a sociology professor see as one of the leading causes of students not understanding or knowing financial literacy? So I think that one is that we absolutely don't teach it in the school system at all, right? I mean, like you would have to become a business major and then go get your master's, right, to really try to understand like some of the ins and outs of some of these things. So one, we're definitely not getting it from the school system. And a lot of times people can get a little bit from their parents, but a lot of people just they don't understand themselves. So then how are they going to pass it on to their children? What do you think as a society can be done to improve the understanding of financial literacy within home and school aspects? I think that it would be great if we did start offering classes on financial literacy, right? Starting in high school, just in terms of, again, just like budgeting. And I've seen a little bit, like I have a son who's in middle school and he needs to, you know, decide on a career and then budget for a house. And he decided he needs to be a sociology professor because that's what he does. He must be so proud of you. But so I think that there's, you know, there's a little bit there. But we definitely, at that time, you know, kids don't have a job and they're just like, the sky's the limit and I'm going to be a millionaire. I mean, you should hear the stuff my son says. He's like, oh, I'm going to go with five of my friends and we're going to buy this million dollar house at the beach. And I'm like, but what job are you going to have? Right. So until people are really living in it and they have to start managing their bills, like that's when we really need to outreach to them. Like people should always and I think it's like financial advisors are so expensive, but I feel like everybody should have access to a financial advisor. And that should really be something that, I mean, we should have, you know, like nonprofits or community groups where it shouldn't cost money because the people who need it the most don't have the money to pay for that. Right. And so we should really have more community organizations and outreach where someone could just come and say, I need help. Right. And to be able to sit down with somebody to help give them that financial advice. Love that response. This is going to be my last question for you. As you do have a degree in sociology, and do you agree with how understanding how intergenerational patterns can be broken? Can you give us a little bit of insight on how those intergenerational patterns can be broken if we taught financial literacy? So, right. So if we look at, you know, historically, who has had access to build wealth in this country? Right. We see that there's definitely a gap between white wealth, black wealth and other groups of color. We see that there's definitely gaps by gender, by sex. Right. And so and by class. Right. So people from lower classes have less access to building wealth. And so definitely on a systemic level, we should definitely have programs, right, to help people to build wealth, to understand how to do that. And, you know, that's definitely like at a macro level, at the micro level, like it can definitely start with just trying to teach people. Right. I mean, one of the best ways to build wealth and financial security in the US is through home ownership. So how can we educate people on how they can how they can buy a home? Right. That's something that, you know, that we can all engage in. And but it has to be both. It has to be both educating people on what they can do, but also, you know, working with government programs to make sure that it's accessible for people. Awesome. Do you have any advice for any of our podcast listeners on a aspect where you see it from as a sociologist that you could give in a sense towards students and everyday people who are trying to understand financial literacy? My advice from a sociologist perspective on a sociologist perspective, you know, and the sad thing is that we don't really have a lot of these classes, like probably at your local college. Right. Or even university. Right. Unless you're taking like these business classes. But there are some classes that you can take that you have to look for them. So I would say if you can. Right. And sometimes like, you know, you can listen to financial advisors like Susie Orman or, you know, or, you know, try to do some reading on your own. But I mean, the more that you can learn, the better you are. And I know that for myself. Right. Like even within sociology, like intro to social, we have a chapter where we talk about inequality, right. Poverty and wealth. And so something that I try to do is kind of going off script, but to try to give some people some of these financial literacy tools that you're not finding anywhere else. And so I know it's hard, but, you know, if you can be out there looking for it, it's probably just going to take a lot of research on your own to figure out some of this stuff, though. OK, that concludes all the questions I have for you. I want to thank you for being here and letting me pick your brain. Here we have Maria Martin, a professor of Ethnic Studies at COS. Thank you for joining us for this podcast. I just wanted to ask you, what's the first thing that comes to mind when you think of financial literacy? The first thing that comes to mind is overwhelming. We get a lot of people with that response. Has there ever been an instance where you feel that maybe the education system has failed in educating you on financial literacy and how that's affected you? Yeah, absolutely. My whole experience in education, starting from K-12, never ever was taught or had any classes in financial literacy. And even in my undergrad, my bachelor's and my master's in grad school, never ever was taught that explained financial literacy. So my whole trajectory in education, there was a lack of. I never had. And so how has that affected you later into your life? It affected me because when I was younger, I probably didn't make the best financial choices. I didn't really save. I knew nothing about retirement accounts, investing, high-yield savings, nothing like that. And then I didn't really get involved into financial literacy till my mid-20s. And at that point, it was now knowing what I know, they usually tell you that it needs to start young and as soon as possible. I kind of felt like I was trying to catch up. And it also affected me because everything that I know now is self-taught. And so I'm just with the information I have, I do the best with my situation and like my finances and stuff like that. But essentially, sometimes I'm like, is this the best decision? I don't have like a financial accountant or an expert telling me how to manage my money. I'm just doing the best with what I have. Yeah, making the best of necessarily what you haven't been taught because you've never been taught that. And so is there maybe something in your day-to-day life that you see now has affected you because of the lack of education? Probably like investing and that sort of stuff and like savings, because if I would have started younger, I would have had way more money than I have now. And my investments would have been larger and my money would have increased because of the compound interest. So that would have helped me so much now that I am in my adult life, making large purchases like a few years ago and buying my house and my car and stuff like that. So you mentioned buying a house. How did you feel in the process of buying a house? Kind of going back to the first question, overwhelmed. It was really scary. I did the whole process by myself since my parents and loved ones live in Bakersfield. So even like looking at houses, signing paperwork, there was a lot of language that I didn't know, signing contracts that I really didn't know what they meant. Everything added up, right? So the inspections and having to have like this money and here and there. So that was really challenging. And seeing how fast my money left, all the savings I've had for years went to the down payment, to the closing cost, to all the inspections. And in a competitive market, I still had to put more than what the property was asking for. It was very overwhelming and confusing and scary. Thank you. And so now that you've bought your house and you're living in the middle of it and after you've dealt with your process of, you know, all your financial obstacles, how do you deal with your house and your mortgage and your payments and stuff now? And how does financial literacy play a role into that? Honestly, it's still a struggle because no one really explains all the costs that it comes, that buying a house comes with. So anything that needs to be repaired, it's on you, right? So you have to have a pocket of money for savings and emergency funds and also make sure everything else is paid for, including the mortgage, right? It's like all your bills, your utilities, your car, your insurances, your groceries. So it's really trying to budget. I think that's really important. Budget your money, have savings, have an emergency fund. And that affects me because when you purchase a house specifically on your own, you are responsible for everything. So all my furniture, everything was on me. And so because of that, some of it I used credit cards. So in addition to all my regular expenses, I have to pay off my credit cards and then things come up like having to replace my roof or small damages, small fixes. That's pretty much how it affects me. Like it's still an ongoing process. And for people who have recently bought a house, I would say it takes them a few years to really give back to some kind of financial freedom and financial stability. That's, yeah, I can imagine that. And so now that you've shared with us your personal, like your personal experience with the repercussions of lack of education and financial literacy in the education system, what's your opinion on what the education system can do to better prepare students? I feel like it needs to start very young, not even just in high school, but learning about money and being comfortable with money at a young age. So even like small age related projects and tasks for younger folks and then in high school, really getting more into detail because that's a pivotal time in people's lives where they're entering adulthood. And it's very important for them to know about money and become financial literate. Sorry. And then in college, I feel like it needs to continue. It's not just a one time class, a semester, a year. I feel like financial literacy is always changing with the trends in the economy and inflation and your location, et cetera, that it needs to continue. Right. Just like we have GEs in high school and in college and in undergrad, I think financial literacy should be a required class, a required GE, and there should be, again, throughout the education system. And even after that, I feel like colleges, for example, could have more workshops, events, trainings. So in case students want to learn more, they have that opportunity where they can speak to financial advisors, accountants, experts, and how to invest, et cetera. So I think that's really would be the solution is to implement that early on K through 12 and then continue in higher education. Yes, I completely agree with that. Thank you for sharing. Yeah, of course. Now that we've just finished taking a listen to what happens when the education system doesn't educate us on financial literacy and its effects even all the way into adulthood, we're all going to come back to the table to discuss the meal. So in the narrative interview, when I was interviewing the professor, I really just realized that her experience with financial literacy was not much. And what she did know is what she taught herself. And therefore, that just kind of goes to prove what we've been discussing in this podcast, how the school system doesn't really educate kids or even adults on what they need to know to be prosperous in life and be able to make secure financial decisions. And throughout the questions that I asked her, they seemed pretty vague, which kind of leads me to determine that even at this adult age, after she's bought a house, after she's made these big purchases in her life where she would need to be financially literate, she still hasn't had much of a exposure or a complete understanding of what financial literacy is. I agree with what you're saying because I interviewed a professor for my expert interview and she was using a fallacy of either or reasoning, which is a fallacy that is falsely offers only two possible alternatives, even through a broad range of possibilities. She more so touched on that because she was stating that the simple fact of if we taught financial literacy in educational systems like high school, college, or even had more programs that were free and available to the everyday people, that we would understand where she is in, as an example, that appealed more so to like how thesis was like characters saying that people that are living in poverty, don't necessarily know that how to budget. So that's why they stay in poverty because they don't understand like budgeting, saving, having different bank accounts for different things. And if we taught those things in schools and it would educate like parents to be able to teach it to the kids that the schools aren't able to, it's just putting yourself out there to apply it to like real life situations. And she was also applying to logos by doing that also because it was touching on like the reasonings of it and how that, like I said, because people are in poverty, that it could be easily changed by a couple little things. Another one I found interesting was one of our word on the streets. We asked her what is financial literacy and after like analyzing it and like realizing the bias of how she didn't really like understand it. And it's technically not her fault because she was never like taught financial literacy. And she was saying mainly the statement was towards like books and paying for school and just focusing on the school education part of it. But financial literacy is just like a bigger, more broader aspect. It touches on like so much more stuff. And that was like a very overall basic response from some of the word on the streets because they don't really understand financial literacy. And that was something that I found there was bias and just understanding it was a very high priority that I think we should really understand. I remember that one when she was like, I think the way she broke it down was financial. So she thought money and then literacy. She interpreted that as like books, like actually reading, all those kinds of things like that. And I think it just like you said, I like what you said, how it goes to show how the education system has really failed in even letting us know the basics of what we need to make smart choices in life. Yeah, I agree with you guys. And I also, in some word on the streets, I also hear a little bit of bias because they tend to blame the government for our fault of losing money, not managing it good. So yeah, it's a little bit of political bias for some people on this subject. Yeah, and I also found how it was interesting the way he was always mentioning how they're wanting us to be broke. But I also like how he wants this to be taught in school. So, you know, maybe it's people actually know that financial literacy is like an issue because no one actually really knows what's going on with it. And then like how to actually prepare a person to take care of your yourself financially and how to actually manage money. So kind of like the government, like not wanting us to like have logic or reasoning aka like logos and understanding like how to manage our bills and stuff. It's like how he's kind of like putting it out there. He's very passionate. But that's good, though, because like we're as a society after COVID, we're like struggling with inflation and stuff. So I feel like he was passionate about it because he probably understands it. Like all of us are college students. We're all broke. I feel like he's actually applying what's going on right now to the real world with such inflation going on. Yeah. And applying it to his answers.