Ep 56 PJW pt4

Hi, I'm Jess. And I'm Tiff. And we are your curious cousins. Where we talk about everything kooky and spooky in the state of Oklahoma. Welcome to episode 56. Welcome. How are you? Great. So, we started this recording and found out my mic is dead. So, we're real close. We are sharing the same mic, because otherwise we'd be making a road trip to Walmart and that just didn't seem conducive to our time management skills right now. Uh, yeah. That's true. So, how are you? Great. How are you? Oh, I'm good. I'm good. Just went back to work this week and have kids again and just learning all the science-y things. I'm going to inflate my planetarium tomorrow, because I have an inflatable planetarium. That's really exciting. I bet that's going to be a lot of fun. Oh, the kids are just ready. They're ready. Um, I am off this week and I am going to Branson. Whoop, whoop. I leave tomorrow. That's why we're recording. That's exciting. That's super exciting. Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. So, part four. Jess, is this going to be the end? I don't know how much more I can take of this. It is. It's going to be the end. It's going to be a long one, I think. I think it might be a little longer than our normal ones, our normal episodes, but this is it. This is the conclusion. No more after this. Dun, dun, dun. So, are you ready to just, like, jump right in? Yes, I am. Okay. Sources are the same. Good. Quick recap. Police, hang on. Let me. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. Police arrest Lester Youngwolf and his family. So, in Oklahoma in the 1950s, arraignments and preliminary hearings were held in common plea courts while trials were set in district courts. On Monday, April 6, 1953, Buster was taken to the common pleas court in front of Judge Stanley Edmister. Buster entered a plea of guilty hoping his confession would gain the court's leniency, but of course that didn't work. Judge Edmister denied Buster's plea and entered a plea of not guilty and set his preliminary hearing for Friday, April 10. Buster was assigned Quinn Dickinson as his public defender. Buster actually rejected Dickinson, saying that he didn't want a public defender. I think he did this because he thought that since he confessed already and said that he was guilty, that this whole ordeal would finally just be over and he'd be able to get some rest and basically move on, but that wasn't the case. I need to take my jacket off. My head got in the way. So, Sheriff Field, and I think it looks like it's working, Sheriff Field had, oh crap, I forgot to tap on my desktop. I knew I was going to do that. So, Sheriff Field had given the story of Buster's confession to the Tulsa Tribune and had then made arrangements with Tulsa World to get an exclusive story, and Buster was going to show the authorities how he killed the girl, Phyllis, at the actual scene of the crime. That's right, that's right. I guess there's nothing better than profiting off of a young girl's brutal murder, and I'm rolling my eyes right now, and that's exactly what happened. Buster was taken from his jail cell that afternoon and taken to his neighborhood. This was in violation of his constitutional rights. The authorities forced him to recreate the murder for the Tulsa World cameras because they documented this entire thing. What? No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Yes. No. No. Yes. The audience of this morbid tour included six law enforcement officials, a Tulsa World reporter and photographer, and Buster's wife, Betty. Before this captivated audience, Buster led the group with his hands cuffed in front of them as he recreated the murder of Phyllis Jean Warren. There was quite the crowd that came out to see this performance, but one main person was missing, Elliot Howe, Buster's new public defender, his new attorney. I laugh because this is unbelievable. This is unbelievable. I mean, I shouldn't be disbelief in disbelief, but I can't even talk. This whole thing is just bonkers. Yeah. So, Elliot Howe's salary as a Tulsa County public defender was like a pittance. I think that's how you put it. Yeah. Pittance. Yeah. Yeah. He was paid $250 a month, handling like somewhere, sometimes over 50 cases a month with no office, no staff, and no expense money. It was only him who worked part-time trying to help those who couldn't afford to help themselves, and this wasn't enough to even feed his family, but he still did it. So, Elliot was 33 years old, but he looked much older. I can imagine. He was also part Native American. He and Buster looked as if they could be related, though Howe was of Creek Nation and Buster was Cherokee, and Howe actually had a little bit lighter skin than Buster did, but they still looked like they could be related. Elliot Howe was not unaware of what was going on. He had read the papers just like everyone else. He knew that Buster had confessed to murdering an 11-year-old girl, and based solely on what he knew, he did believe Buster to be a monster, but he still believed that he deserved a defense. Howe... Sorry. It's just kind of weird, you know? Caught it! It's because I'm leaning and wobbling. Howe first met Buster's mother, Bessie, on April 6th at the courthouse. She, of course, pleaded with him and told him how Buster had been treated, or she called it railroaded, how he was railroaded by the county. Of course, he had heard all of this before and he just kind of chalked it up to a heartbroken mother. Howe was having a bit of a hard time with the case because he was a new dad himself and of a daughter, no less, and he was defending someone who had killed an 11-year-old girl. Somebody's daughter. Right. But he knew that he couldn't let that get in the way of him doing his job. He was very honorable. So when Howe met Buster at noon at the Tulsa County Jail, Buster looked as if he could be Howe's kid brother, kind of like I said. He also looked tired and gaunt, and he didn't talk very much. And I think it's probably safe to say that at this point, Buster, having spent the last five days doing nothing but talking, was convinced that this lawyer was irrelevant at best and untrustworthy at most. So I think he just had a very kind of low opinion. He hasn't had the best experience with the county employees so far. Nobody seemed to be interested in what Buster had to say, only in telling him what to say. Buster probably thought that Howe defending him was just a formality and that he had just thought that he wouldn't see Howe again before the arraignment. And Howe, I think, thought the same thing. However, by that afternoon, Howe was starting to have a different opinion. So I just told y'all how the law officials and the reporter and photographer from Tulsa took Buster to recreate the murder. Well, Howe wasn't invited to go along with him. In fact, he wasn't even told about it. He was furious. That's against the law. Howe told the county attorney and the sheriff later that afternoon that no one was to talk to Buster without him being present. That should have thrown the whole case out right there. That should have thrown the entire case out right there. He spoke to the Tulsa World saying that he was seeking an injunction in common pleas court. And for those who don't know, an injunction or temporary restraining order is an order from the court prohibiting a party from performing or ordering a specified act either temporarily or permanently. So Howe also said that he was seeking to restrain county officials from talking to, communicating statements from, or, quote, in any way further violating the constitutional rights of his defendant. So in this injunction, Howe is going to point out that Buster had been jailed for five days without being charged with a crime. Also, that Buster had effectively been forced to give false testimony when he had been taken to the supposed scene of the crime and forced to reenact it, which was a violation of his amendment rights. Howe left no room for interpretation. Buster was innocent until proven guilty. Even though Howe had ejected, the Tulsa World still published the article with pictures of Buster in handcuffs. Howe spent the day getting up to speed on Buster's case, gathering his own evidence. The more he dug into the case, the more horrified he was by everything that the authorities did or didn't do. So they didn't visit any of the bars where Buster said he went drinking. They didn't talk to everyone in the neighborhood either. If they had, they would have learned that not just four, but six convicted sex criminals left the neighborhood home. Six. They didn't even find any physical evidence that supported Buster's statement. That's right. So all the authorities had was Buster's confession. His coerced confession. Right. After he was under torment. Right. For two days almost. Right. So all the authorities, oh wait, no, I just wrote that. They hadn't conducted a sufficient investigation, just a five-day interrogation, where they also just paraded Buster around in front of cameras. Hal got a call from Buster in the county jail late in the evening that same day, saying that he needed to speak to Hal and that it was urgent. I'm sure it was. Buster told Hal that he didn't do it. He wasn't the one who murdered Phyllis. Hal, of course, was confused and was like, but you literally just confessed. You literally just confessed to this. Buster admitted to Hal that, quote, they worked on me for five days. I only slept four hours. Every time I stretched out to sleep, they brought me back for more questioning. I tell you, they wouldn't let me alone. And they said, if I kept on being smart, that they'd really work me. End quote. He also told Hal how the authorities told Buster about those knee and elbow prints we talked about that they supposedly found at the scene of the crime. He told Hal that he knew they didn't because he didn't do it, but it was their word against his and who was going to believe an ex-convict. He told Hal how the authorities promised to get him off with a light sentence if he confessed. Otherwise, they would send him to the electric chair. I mean, that's what they told him. And he knew they could do it, so he confessed. Hal was still somewhat skeptical because Buster, like I said, just literally confessed to the rape and murder of an 11-year-old just 36 hours prior to this. And, like, was giving details. Right. Which we find out aren't the correct. I mean, we found out last week they weren't really the right details, but the law enforcement were going to ignore that it didn't match up exactly. Yeah, I mean, they did nothing to, like, check out his statement or his confession, like, at all. So... This will be fun to edit. Hal... Okay. Hal was good at knowing... I feel like I'm shouting. Well, it's because we're all so farther away. Hal was good at knowing when he was dealing with a liar, but there was just something about the way Buster spoke to him that made him have a gut feeling that he was telling the truth. Hal called in the courthouse reporter, Troy Gordon, who was also covering the story for the Tulsa World, and had even been at the reenactment the day before. Together, Hal and Gordon questioned Buster for the rest of the night, and they were asking, like, all the questions. They didn't let up. It was like another interrogation, but they wanted to know all of it. Gordon actually challenged Buster's belief that the authorities could put his mother in prison. When asked why he believed that, Buster told Gordon that he just thought that if they were able to get enough on him to convict him, they could do the same to his mother. His family didn't have any money to help protect themselves, so that was one of his concerns. After questioning Buster for three hours, Hal was beginning to see that Buster wasn't the monster that he was being portrayed as. The law and the press had formed the narrative about Buster, and Hal was beginning to see that it was a lie for what it was, which I basically just said. Hal made sure that Buster understood that if he was lying about everything, that if he got on the witness stand and got caught up in his lies, that he would get the electric chair. Buster was adamant that he didn't do it. All of Tulsa, the law, the press, and even Buster's own wife didn't really believe him. Oh, man. Troy Gordon rushed off to write the next day's article with Buster's side of the story, and it was basically like a tell-all kind of article. It mentioned how Buster said he confessed because he was exhausted and hungry, how he had been threatened, how words were put in his mouth. It was like a completely different article than what they just put out. County attorney Robert Wheeler denied all of these statements and insisted that Buster's confession was not given under pressure. He also claimed that he had made that clear to Buster at both the beginning and the end of the signed statement. Oh, but there's no recording. Right. And the other people that may have been in the room would probably collaborate with your story. Right. So, yeah. He completely twisted everything. Of course he did. He knew he was caught. Right. He told the papers that he was able to see his mom and wife every time he asked. They fed him, asked Buster if he wanted anything. When Wheeler was asked if Buster was sleepy, he was quoted as saying, so were we. Oh, really? Really? Okay. So, you were up the entire time, too. Right. For five days straight. When talking to the Tulsa Tribune and its readers, Wheeler had brought up some of the murder cases from the past and made it clear. He purposely brought these specific cases up and it was so that Tulsa County had a history of young men of color raping and murdering young white women, confessing to the crime and then recanting their confession on the claim that they were threatened and coerced by authorities. Baloney. Right. Buster's claims were nothing new. He had killed Phyllis and that was it. That's what the county attorney basically put out there. What Wheeler was actually doing was creating his narrative for the persuadable press and appealing to a public that was already looking for convenient truth, as they put it. Nobody liked the thought of the law forcing a confession out of an innocent man and the thought was troubling. Not only that, but the thought that a rapist and a murderer was still on the loose somewhere was a disturbing thought. Howe was taking a stand and he knew that changing the people's mind and what they believed about Buster, it would not be an easy task. He basically was like, it's going to take a miracle. What is it? Are you still recording? Yeah. I feel really weird being this close to you and staring at you. I know, it's a little odd. I have to look away because I'm like... No, that's totally fine because I feel like I'm like... Read to us, Jessica. Okay, where was I? I don't know. See, I can't. Howe was definitely alone in his belief of Buster's innocence. After Buster's very public denial of committing the crime, Howe tried to prevent the county attorney and the sheriff from questioning Buster any further. He claimed that the authorities had violated Buster's constitutional rights by holding him for five days without charge and by forcing him to reenact the crime. Wheeler fought back by saying that at the time of the reenactment, he didn't know that Howe was Buster's attorney. Judge Elmer Adams didn't agree with Howe. He said that although Wheeler had violated, quote, a canon of the bar association by communicating with Buster without Howe present, but had not violated the constitution, Howe's appeal to prevent the county from speaking to Buster was denied. Howe. Well, why do I even ask myself that, Howe? I mean, the longest they should have been able to hold him was 72 hours, and that's the longest without charging him. Yeah. And when he had five days, so that's 120 hours. Mm-hmm. So Howe wanted Wheeler's reassurance that it wouldn't happen again, but was denied. Excuse me. Thanks for not doing that in my face. That would have been so rude. I probably punched you. Probably. I wouldn't have blamed you. I'm really close. I know. Wheeler didn't see a reason for the court to forbid the county from unethical acts because, quote, we have done nothing unethical. What? Right? This whole thing is just janky. I mean, Wheeler was contradicting himself in the press, and only Howe had the guts to call him out on it. Wheeler didn't care, though. He was winning, and just to rub it in even more, he said Howe's petition was ridiculous. One sad thing about this, too, was Buster Youngwolf's family was being threatened, like, daily. His brother-in-law went into work one day to find a note that said, do not be there when B comes to trial. I mean it, and you know that. Who and what the note meant was never determined, but it wouldn't be the only time that someone related to Buster would be threatened. So, don't be at work or don't be at the trial. They don't know. On Friday, April 10th, Howe hit another bump in the road. The court had given Howe permission to use court funds to hire a private investigator. He selected a man by the name of Ray Graves, a former Tulsa policeman and county investigator. Is that legal, to use county or court funds to hire a private investigator? Shouldn't that be private funds used to hire a private investigator, since court funds should already be used to be paying said investigators? Isn't that the police's job? I don't know how that works. But he got permission to do it. That's weird, because I mean, I, as citizen Q here, I don't want my money, my tax dollars being used to hire a private investigator, like, that a private investigator is private. I just, like, that just blows my mind, because, like, actual investigators are police officers, right? And that's what our tax dollars go for. Interesting. Interesting. Sorry. That's fine. So, like I said, Graves was a former member of the local law enforcement agency. No, sorry. Sorry. So Graves, like I said, he was a former Tulsa police officer and a county investigator. Wheeler was against this choice on the basis that Ray Graves was a former member of a local law enforcement agency, and Wheeler's objection had enough for Howell's request to be denied. Howell fought back by bringing up that there were six convicted sex offenders living in the neighborhood where Phyllis was killed, just letting loose, and that he thought that they would find the killer among them. I mean. So this angered. There's a good chance that that could happen. This angered Wheeler, and so Wheeler said that they had made a thorough investigation, and they were convinced that they had the right man. By provoking the county, the local authorities, a symbol of law and order, it was being brought to light, like all of these issues, I guess we can call them. The ploy definitely brought him attention, but not many friends. People were saying super mean things about him, like he was only doing this to make a name for himself, or that he was just a public, or it was just like a public stunt, and they said that he was just going to hang himself right there with Buster. Howell did end up getting to hire Phil San Angelo, a retired county deputy sheriff. Howell and San Angelo spent a whole day with Buster, again, going over all of the details of Phyllis's disappearance. By the end of it, not only did Howell believe in Buster's innocence, but San Angelo did as well. Howell even went so far as to say that he knew who the real killer was. I always get nervous when people say stuff like that. You know, like, oh, I know who the real killer is. They're like, oh. Well, just wait. Oh, no. Oh, no. After San Angelo began investigating the case and checking out the neighborhood, Howell's hot suspect, and I'm doing quotes here, very quickly became a very, very hot suspect. Uh-oh. So, we talked about those six sex offenders that lived in Phyllis's neighborhood that the authorities never once questioned. Well, San Angelo narrowed in on one suspect in particular. Howell wanted to bring the suspect in and make him take a lie detector test just like Buster had, but there was one problem. It wasn't working, was it? Who was going to make the arrest? Oh, well, yeah. That'd be a problem, too. Because being hasty and inexperienced, Howell failed to request that San Angelo be given all the rights of a law officer, which included carrying a firearm and making arrests. Oh, man. Judge Edmister didn't see a problem with San Angelo having these rights, but, of course, Wheeler wasn't having it. Wheeler threw up a big stink saying that San Angelo had no more right to make an arrest than a private citizen did, no matter what his background was. Furthermore, he had opposed the court's appointing of Ray Grace for that same reason. So, Wheeler was the one man who could grant San Angelo the authority to make an arrest, but he had no reason to do so. So, while Howell had his special investigator and his suspect, his hands were tied, and he couldn't do anything with either. Could there have been a loophole where he could have, like, not that they have, like, Crimestoppers back then, but, like, left, like, an anonymous tip or something? But I wonder how many tips are really left in real life and that aren't investigated. Mm-hmm. I know. Sorry, I lost my train of thought. No, you're fine. Even though Howell and San Angelo were convinced that they knew who had killed Phyllis, they never publicly named their suspect. Wheeler said, or Wheeler did say that if Howell presented the county attorney's office with enough evidence to justify the arrest of the suspect, then a law officer would make the arrest. This was an empty public gesture because the defense team finding the real murderer would be a game changer for two reasons. The first being that if the defense ended up finding the real killer, this would kill the prosecution's case. Well, that current case, they would eventually have to, I mean, they'd have to go back to Square One and do all that work again. Right. Oh, no. So the second reason being it would humiliate and delegitimize the police, the sheriff's office, and the county in one fell swoop. Well, when you take shortcuts, I mean, sometimes you go, yeah. So Wheeler couldn't have the humiliation of charging the wrong man based on a false confession, but add in the fact that the real murderer was discovered by a security guard turned special investigator, his words, not mine, within 24 hours of being hired. Nah, he wouldn't have that. He couldn't have that. Wheeler was quoted as saying, quote, we believe him, buster. To be guilty beyond any doubt, we have no intention of reopening the investigation because we are sure we have the guilty man, unquote. The problem that Howe was having is that he would gain like two steps and then he'd move two steps forward and like 10 steps back. Right, right, right. He couldn't win for losing. So just a few days after he had hired San Angelo to make this craptastic ice cream sundae even better. That's a good, that's a good, that's a good analogy. Just a few days after he had hired San Angelo as a special private investigator, San Angelo resigned. San Angelo claimed it had nothing to do with the case and whether or not he believed Buster to be innocent or guilty. He claimed that he just couldn't put the time, the job required. Part of me wonders if a certain county got a hold of him and made some threats, but I mean, I don't know. That's just my thought. I don't know if that happened or not. I'm going to call baloney on that one too. Howe did get a little bit of a break when Buster's hearing was moved from Friday, April 17th to the following Friday, April 24th. Reason being that there were just a ton of cases on the docket. So Howe needed, Howe needed all the time that he could get. The preliminary hearing would determine whether Buster's case would go to a jury trial. Howe was hoping to avoid a trial due to the public's already bad opinion of Buster. Yeah, how would they find a jury that was not biased at this point? Because at this point everyone's heard of him. It's a media circus. Yes. Also, without the ability to make an arrest and with a special investigator now out of the picture, his focus shifted from going after another suspect to solely just defending Buster. So remember when we talked about the authorities not going to any of the bars that Buster said he went to that night? Yep. Well, Howe did just that. Several bartenders and patrons said they saw Buster at different points both during the day and night that was in question. So there were witnesses saying, yes, we saw him that night at this bar. Kind of hard to be at two places at once. But I don't know. Lots of law enforcement seems to think that this is possible. So Howe also went to the brush pile where Phyllis's body had been found. What he found was that the dirt that was packed, like the dirt was packed in so tightly, even in a relatively warm April, this would have made it almost impossible for Buster to have dug a grave with his bare hands on a chilly March night like he said he did. Even if Buster had used the tin can to help with the digging, his prints weren't found anywhere near that. And the authorities' claims was nothing but speculation. Howe took it upon himself to comb the neighborhood and discovered three suspects, each with a compelling lead. First one. One was a man by the name of Tom Bennett, who was one of the six convicted sex offenders living within walking distance of the Warrens' home. Bennett wasn't home when Howe stopped by to ask questions and he actually asked his wife where her husband was on the night of March 12th. Mrs. Bennett said that her husband was out drinking and returned past midnight with mud all over his pants. He wouldn't tell her where he had gone. The second, Howe also spoke to a man by the name of Lester Goosby, who worked at the nearby rendering plant. Goosby told Howe that a young man who had raped a baby had been staying with the Warrens on the night of Phyllis' disappearance and had left the next morning without a word. Staying with the Warrens? That's what he said. Now, there's nothing corroborating this, however, so there's no telling if his claim actually has any validity to it or not. As worried as Phyllis' mother was, I could see that that wasn't true. But with as unmotivated as her father seemed, it gets crazy. I mean, I can't say yes or no to that one. So the third, this is the most troubling. This is the most troubling? Howe discovered that on the morning of April 2nd, the day that Phyllis' body was found, that Ellis and Clarence Youngwolf, which remember that's Buster's father and brother, along with Milford Williams, these are also his drinking buddies that he was with, had been out hunting for scrap iron. Now, Clifton Brooks, Buster's brother-in-law, was also in this field hitting golf balls. There was four men were close to the brush pile where Phyllis' body was found. According to them, Robert Warren, Phyllis' father, appeared out of nowhere, walked over to the brush pile, and then he bolted back to his house. Geneva Williams, who's Milford's daughter, claimed that Warren called Joe Brown, who was a friend and neighbor who owned a nearby packing plant, and told his son Bobby to call the police. Like Robert Warren is telling this Bobby to call the police. Robert Warren found Phyllis' body after he'd asked Bobby to call the police, and was there when the police arrived. No one saw Warren hunting for those poke greens that he said he was hunting for, and no one remembers seeing Smokey, Phyllis' dog, who apparently found her body. Each of these men were plausible suspects, yet the authorities never seriously pursued any of these leads. The reason for this could be endless. It could have been from racism or because they were lazy. It could be from corruption or incompetence. It could even come from Jimmy Warren's warning to watch out for his stepson, Buster. Most likely, though, Buster wasn't just targeted for one reason alone. It was probably several reasons. At this point, there was no turning back for the authorities. They were locked in on this, that Buster did it, because they had been very vocal about Buster having been the killer, and their, quote, evidence supported that outcome. It didn't matter that Buster's life was on the line. What mattered most was making sure their reputation stayed intact. I think we're like halfway through. Sorry about that. In Hal's case, his reputation was on the line as well. People who he thought were his friends abandoned him. He became a pariah, an outcast, because he chose to defend a man who confessed to killing a child. He was ostracized. The only supporter he had left was his wife, Imelda. The strain was really starting to wear on him and his wife, and Hal knew that the cards that he had he needed to keep close to his chest in order to save Buster. So April 24th, 1953. The preliminary hearing begins. The courthouse was packed out for the preliminary hearing of Buster Younglove. About 20 people were left standing because there were so many there to bear witness to this event that the only thing they could do was stand. Most of them stayed the whole day as well. And the tension that had been kind of brewing between Hal and Wheeler, it now spilled over into the courtroom. Wheeler was constantly objecting to Hal's cross-examinations of the state's witnesses, criticizing Hal's, quote, attempts to explore the evidence we have and making fun of him for not asking, quote, intelligible questions. Hal snapped back with, quote, I'm not treating this as lightly as the county attorney. I have to ask about these things because I wasn't there. The state submitted a key piece of evidence, those 20 photos that were taken by the Tulsa World that documented Phyllis's mangled mud cake body being removed from the brush pile. That had been admitted into evidence. It was definitely a gruesome sight for those in the courtroom who had never seen the photos before, and Hal objected to the photos even being admitted in the first place. But Judge Ed Mister overruled him. Deputy Houston Johnson was the state's next witness to take the stand. He testified that Buster was informed of his constitutional rights when he was questioned and that no threats or promises were made. He also described the long weekend of Buster's interrogation and denials before he finally confessed to the murder. Wheeler then submitted a crucial piece of evidence, Buster's signed confession. Hal then demanded that he be given some time to study the confession because even after all this time, the county had never given him a copy or even allowed him to see it. He was given five minutes to read over it, and when he did, he objected to it being admitted. Once again, he was denied. Wow, where is the unbiased here? Exactly. Like, it's so crazy. The judge is so one-sided. Oh, yeah. Next to testify for the state was Sheriff Bill Field, who said that Buster was told his fingerprints were on the belt and that he could get the electric chair for lying. He also admitted that he had recorded Buster and his mother's private conversations, which set off a shouting match between the prosecution and the defense. I'm going to go back to this. So they had the capabilities to record conversations, yet they failed to do it with their own people and a suspect, but they definitely did it when there was a suspect and somebody else. Somebody random. Yeah, absolutely. In the end, though, it didn't matter because the tape wasn't available, and it turns out that most of it was inaudible. Inaudible. So there were more on at the same time. They couldn't set it up properly. Oh, Lord have mercy. When it came time for the defense to call witnesses, it became obvious that Wheeler had spent more time in the courtroom than Howe had and Howe's inexperience was kind of showing. However, Wheeler had a difficult time disguising how messy the county's investigation really was. Thank goodness. Kooky fact. During county investigator Ace Lang's testimony, Howe and Wheeler argued over Lang's qualifications as an expert. What's interesting is that Lang finally admitted he was not an expert and confessed that Phyllis' body was never examined to determine her cause of death. Finally, finally, finally something goes right. That is ridiculous. Oh, my gosh. Under Sheriff Gene Maxey recounted Buster's reenactment of the crime. He also admitted that no one followed Buster's signed confession to see if it matched or if Buster was in fact just making it up as he went along. There were many, many testimonies that followed, none actually producing any kind of knock you off your feet information. This wasn't Howe's point, though. Howe wanted to get every witness's testimony on the record to discredit the county's case, which solely relied on Buster's confession. The judge complained telling Howe that the court had been, quote, patient and long-suffering, basically that he was taking too long. Yeah, right, right. While Wheeler lost his cool and claimed that Howe was on a, quote, fishing expedition, a statement that Judge Edmister agreed with. Judge, you keep your mouth shut. Howe, though, didn't deny it. But Judge Edmister ended up calling a recess to the preliminary hearing until the following Monday. Oh, we're still in the prelims. Yeah. Oh, my goodness. I forgot about that. I'm really sorry. I know. That's a long episode. So on Monday, March, on Monday, April 27th, when the court resumed again, it was like a boxing match between Howe and Wheeler, back and forth, back and forth. By the time that Friday came around, Judge Edmister ruled that, quote, the statement that he, Buster, made in his confession is ample to make a case against him. So Howe asked that the judge, if there was enough evidence to prove the girl had died by strangulation. But we can't know that because it was already admitted that her body was not properly examined. Well, if the county could not prove that Phyllis had been killed by strangulation, given there had been no autopsy, then Buster's confession that he had strangled her to death was useless. Wheeler said, you don't have to find any in such a case. Judge Edmister agreed. What? What? Mm-hmm. Judge Edmister stated that Buster would be held without bond, and Buster Youngwolf's fate would be decided before a jury of his peers, made up of men and women in the city that already found him guilty. So Buster was going to trial. After spending weeks retracing the events and interviewing people, Howe believed Buster had an irrefutable alibi for Thursday, March 12th, 1953, the night that Phyllis Warren was last seen alive. A kooky incident occurred on May 1st, 1953. Buster's mother, Bessie, was walking with a friend toward her home when a driver in a truck hit her from behind and then sped away, leaving Bessie in a broken heap on the ground. Clarence Youngwolf, Buster's brother, saw the whole thing and chased after the truck, but couldn't catch him. He did manage to get the license plate number before running back to his mother. She was still alive, and the state troopers were able to locate the truck around 11 o'clock that night and had arrested a 56-year-old man by the name of George Grimm, who was charged with leaving the scene of an accident involving personal injury and placed in the county jail. Now this is something I want to point out. This wasn't an accident. He purposely hit her because Buster was her son. This was part of the threat that his family were receiving, and someone actually went out of their way to target his mother. And she's not the only one that will end up getting hurt. Why are these people getting threatened? He's already in jail. Like, let's, I mean, not that I'm not playing the other side here right now, but, okay, like, you've won. Let the justice system that you so believe in do their job. And it looks like that they're going to side with the way you feel anyways or the way things are going. So why are you bothering these innocent people? Right, and it's like they're minding their own business, and yet you're going to, like, purposely hurt them. Like, what do you think that, what did that little old woman have to do with any of this besides the fact that she birthed him, Buster? Right, right. So the next week, while his mother was still in the hospital recovering from her injuries, Buster was found twisting in pain on his bunk. He was in agony. An ambulance was called to the jail, and Buster was rushed to Hillcrest Memorial Hospital for an emergency appendectomy. So his appendix burst. Wednesday, May 13th, Buster showed up in court looking pale and gaunt from his emergency surgery. Of his appendix burst. Yeah, and Buster was formally arraigned in district court and charged with first-degree murder. Judge Elbin L. Taylor accepted his plea of not guilty and set a trial date of Monday, May 25th, which would be just two weeks away. Because there had never been a formal autopsy done on Phyllis, this was a breach in procedure, and Howe was able to remind reporters that the authorities had failed to conduct a thorough investigation. Therefore, an autopsy was critical to establishing when and how Phyllis had died. This forced Wheeler's hand. So the county attorney received permission from Tulsa and Rogers County to have Phyllis's body exhumed. On Thursday, May 14th, Dr. Leo Lobier, a Tulsa pathologist, examined Phyllis's body. Howe and county investigator Ace Lang were also in attendance at the autopsy. It was confirmed that Phyllis had died by strangulation. However, on closer examination, it was revealed that maggots were growing inside her mouth. Why is this important, you might ask? Because Phyllis's makeshift grave in the neighborhood was too deep for flies to lay eggs, she wasn't buried the night she was killed. Her body had been moved. That was a key piece of information that they learned from this. How much do you hate me now? I don't hate you. I hate this. I hate this. Howe is very much aware that he needed to keep his cards close to his chest and he knew that he needed to put a nail in the coffin of the prosecution's case. But more than that, he had to bury any doubt about Buster's innocence for good. He knew what had to happen to not only Buster but for his family, even if he did get the verdict of not guilty. He knew that even if Buster got not guilty, that there could be ramifications, especially for his son knowing that his father was a child killer and all of this. And that was Howe's main concern. Howe knew of only one way to do this. That way was for Buster to retake the lie detector test. Buster, of course, was reluctant to retake it, but in the end he agreed to do it. Howe believed that he had enough evidence to prove Buster's alibi and that the prosecution couldn't provide beyond a shadow of a doubt that Buster was guilty. Howe also knew the public, and more specifically the jury, needed the symbolism of the polygraph test. So in order for the polygraph test to be admissible in court, both sides had to agree to Buster having it done, not just Buster's agreement to do it. Howe needed Wheeler's assent. Surprisingly, Wheeler agreed. So both Howe and Wheeler signed a court order permitting the results of the lie detector test to be admitted as evidence. There was one stipulation to this. The results would not be revealed until both sides had rested their cases, Neither the prosecution or the defense could know the results until the final testimony on the day of court. Let me re-read that because I said it bad. Neither the prosecution or the defense would know the results until the final testimony on the last day of court. The lie detector test would destroy one case and cement the other, and neither side would actually know until the end. Googly enough, the lie detector machine that was used previously on Buster was in Chicago, and the next closest one was in Kansas City, Missouri. Pack up your thing, it's only a three hour drive. This worked out because Captain Phil Hoyt of Kansas City Police Department was considered the best man possible to operate the machine. On Thursday, May 14th, Buster, Howe, and Deputy Sheriff E.H. King made the four hour trip to Kansas City. Wheeler and Assistant County Attorney Edmondson would arrive the next day to supervise. And so since they got there a day early, Buster was able to sleep on an actual bed, giving him a good night's rest. And he was well rested for the next day. There were actually four tests total in a comprehensive lengthy process that Hoyt employed to demonstrate if Buster was telling the truth or not. Hoyt had conversed separately with the prosecution and the defense to prepare his questions. Each of the four tests would contain ten questions. The first group of questions Hoyt asked Buster had to do with what Buster did that night. Like, were you playing with Phyllis? The first group of questions Hoyt asked Buster had to do with what Buster did that night. Were you playing with Phyllis Jean Warren at your mother's home March 12, 1933? Like, things like that. The second group of questions concerned Buster's alibi. The third group covered the details of Buster's disputed confession. And the fourth group of questions were along the lines of, do you know who killed Phyllis? Did you kill Phyllis? Like, that type of thing. When the test was over, Buster, Howe, and Deputy King made the long drive back home that night. So, the trial. We are finally at the trial. Buster Youngwolf's trial began at 9 a.m. on Monday, May 25, 1953. More than 100 people were packed into the sweltering courtroom, despite it being hotter than Hades. No one wanted to leave and risk missing the trial of a lifetime. Although, 20 years later. There was going to be another one, just like. There were a total of 67 potential jurors. And it was difficult to find any, if not impossible, that hadn't heard of the case before. You mentioned that earlier. I'm really surprised that Howell didn't try to get it moved to Washington County or Osage County. You know, I thought the same thing. I was kind of surprised about that myself. Or Rogers County, you know, or Crete County. This is true. I mean, not that they wouldn't have heard about it either. Right, but maybe. Yeah. The next question to be asked was if they could be fair and impartial. It took a grueling five-hour session in which Howell and Wheeler questioned the potential jurors and finally selected the 12 jurors. The panel consisted of an all-white jury with both men and women sitting as jurors. Howell wanted the jury sequestered during the trial. He wanted to keep them from being influenced from outside sources, and this would also keep them safe. Considering what happened to Buster's mother and the threats made to his family, Wheeler objected, however, and Judge Taylor instructed the jury not to form an opinion, read any newspapers, listen to the radio, or discuss the case with anyone. So, you know. It's impressive that they still do that today too. They really do. They're like, don't talk about it. Don't read about it. Don't talk about it. Don't read about it. Don't watch the news. Don't get on. Yeah. If you felt that passionately about it, then you would put them somewhere. Right. You would sequester them. I know. When I was in jury duty, I was like, I follow the Tulsa PD. So, I was like, I see all that in the Tulsa world and every single news channel. Apple News Alert. The next day, more than 120 spectators packed themselves into the courtroom. Tensions and temperatures were high and set the stage for what was sure to be a very long, hot, Israeli week in May. It's getting to be early summer, so it's starting to get warm. Wheeler recounted Buster's contradictory stories from the night Phyllis disappeared before he broke down and confessed to killing her. He described Buster's confession in grim detail. Without hard evidence, Wheeler relied heavily on witness testimony to provide circumstantial evidence about Buster's whereabouts and his character. One of these witnesses was Josie Warren, Phyllis's mother. When it was House's turn to cross-examine Josie Warren, he had to walk a very fine line. While his goal was to discredit her testimony, he didn't want to come off as like a bully. After weeks of doing interviews and investigating, Howe believed the Warrens were, at best, neglectful parents. When asked, Josie Warren said that she first learned of Phyllis's disappearance when her son woke her up around 11.30 p.m. and she saw that Phyllis was gone, which contradicts what she claimed in the beginning, like our very first episode. Like, and honestly, not that much time passed between the crime and the trial. Right. Like, unlike today when, like, years can pass. Right. Like, only two months really had passed. Right. When, um, let's see, she said she went back to sleep assuming her daughter was staying the night with a friend or the young wolf. When she was informed that wasn't the case, it wasn't until that night that the Warrens contacted the police. She told Howe she suspected Buster to be involved with Phyllis's disappearance when her son Jimmy told her that Phyllis and Buster disappeared at the same time. Wheeler then instructed, or no, sorry, Wheeler then introduced the gruesome photographs taken at the burial site and the, and the funeral home. Dr. Leo Lobier, who did the autopsy on Phyllis when her body was exhumed, he gave a detailed description of what he had found. He was even able to tell what her last meal had been based on the rate of digestion. Dr. Lobier said that Phyllis had been murdered no more than three hours after she had eaten. Buster was put on the stand. After more than a day and a half of testimony, the state rested its case against Buster. Now it was Howe's turn. I'm almost done. No more than three hours after she had last eaten. If they ate at 6, she would have been dead by 9. If they ate at 7, she would have been dead by 10. Like, I don't know how late they ate, but that Buster was supposedly at the bar? Yeah. Buster talked about the shoddy police investigation, his unceasing stream of interrogations, the quote, six known sex, oh wait, no, sorry. Howe talked about the shoddy police investigation, Buster's unceasing stream of interrogations, the six known sex perverts living in the neighborhood, and the suspicious circumstances of Robert Warren of how he found his daughter's body. I'm glad that someone else pointed that out because I did think it was strange that he was the one who found her. He was the one who was unmotivated to do anything. So Howe laid everything out. Buster took the stand again, describing in detail his alibi, recounting to the jury his exact whereabouts on the night of March 12th. He described his linked interrogation and how Undersheriff Gene Maxey led the way during his reenactment of the crime. When he was cross-examined by the prosecution, it was their goal to destroy Buster's claims that the authorities had abused him and given him false promises. By the time the assistant county attorney was done with Buster, he did his job by planting a seed of doubt in the jury's minds. Howe wasn't giving up, though. He got Sheriff Phil to admit to the jury that he had said, quote, I'd keep him in that chair until he told the truth, talking about interrogating Buster until he basically confessed. Howe brought many witnesses that corroborated Buster's alibi. As Thursday was coming to a close, the defense was starting to gain some momentum. Tulsa was now starting to see what Howe had known for weeks. Buster's alibi added up. Piece by piece, the state's case was crumbling. As one person after another took the stand testifying to the truth, a grim and disturbing reality was beginning to take form for the jury. Maybe the county had set Buster up. Maybe. Howe called a critical witness to testify next, Mrs. Milford Williams. Ellis Youngwolf had gotten into a bar fight sometime on March 12th, which helped to establish that Buster was with his drinking buddies that day. Mrs. Williams and Lily May Youngwolf, which was Buster's sister-in-law, left the men to go pay a $10 traffic ticket that Clarence had gotten earlier in the day. When Wheeler asked her if she was positive that she paid the traffic ticket on the same day as the bar fight and she said yes, Wheeler called in a man by the name of Louis Boyd, a police records custodian, who brought Clarence's traffic ticket and a receipt book. That's weird. You pronounce the entire, like every letter in the word. Receipt. I don't know what that was. The book was admitted into evidence. According to the traffic receipt, Mrs. Williams had paid Clarence's $10 traffic ticket, but it was not on March 13th. Hang on. I read that wrong. Clarence's $10 traffic ticket. Nope. Can't read. I'm also staring at you, so it's probably weird. The book was admitted into evidence. According to the traffic receipt, Mrs. Williams had paid Clarence's $10 traffic ticket, but it was on March 13th, not the 12th. Wheeler handed this receipt book to the jury to have a look while Hal questioned Boyd. However, as the receipt book made it to juror number two, Royce Rutter, he raised his hand and Judge Taylor gave him permission to speak. Quote, it appears to me the date on this receipt book has been changed. Rutter had noticed that where the carbon copy said 12, it had been written over in pencil to say 13. The date had been changed. The implication was clear. Someone had tampered with the receipt book. Evidence had been altered. Buster's alibi stood. Hal was furious. The evidence was damning and the county attorney's office was exposed. Wheeler claimed not to have noticed the change and told the police clerks to explain it to him during the 15-minute recess. Wheeler didn't notice it. Wheeler, right? You haven't noticed a lot of things. You're outraged about this? Well, and now Wheeler had to find a way to save face. And this is the reason that was given. The reason for the change in the receipt book was this. The dates on the receipt books were often changed for bookkeeping purposes. If it's after midnight and the book is dated ahead. Who's paying traffic tickets after midnight? It even had markers to show where other dates had been changed. The book was given back to the jury to be passed around, but I think at this point it was kind of like, mm, gut. Right, right, right, right, right. No other reason for the changes were given. Conveniently enough, the officer who signed the receipt was an hour away in Pawhuska and couldn't testify. Oh, that's convenient. Hal called Mrs. Williams and her daughter Geneva to the stand and both testified that Robert Warren had visited the brush pile several times a day. The trial was over except for one last witness, Captain Phil Hoyt of the Kansas City Police Department. He represented neither side, the prosecution or the defense, being loyal only to the truth only. He had been sworn to secrecy and had kept this information to himself for more than a week. Hoyt was sworn in and said he had been with the Kansas City PD for 22 years and had been giving lie detector tests for 16 years. Hoyt said he had been trained by Leonard Keeler, who invented the Keeler's polygraph. He explained how the test worked and all of the ins and outs. He explained how the test was set up for Buster and explained the details for that. Captain Hoyt pulled out a graph that was 15 yards long and explained the test results to the jury. That's not a graph, that's a diary. Right. When Judge Taylor asked the captain what opinion he had formed from the test as to the guilt or innocence of the defendant, Hoyt replied, The lie detector test which I gave Buster Youngwolf compares with hundreds of others which I have given to innocent men. When Buster Youngwolf said he didn't kill Phyllis Jean Horn, Captain Hoyt said, he was telling the truth. Now it was time for closing arguments. The jury deliberated for an hour and 52 minutes. The jury foreman handed the verdict to the judge who scanned it and then read it out loud. Quote, in the case of the Peeble versus Buster Greenville Youngwolf of the murder of Phyllis Jean Horn, the jury finds the defendant not guilty. What? Not guilty. So some aftermath. Wow, wow, wow. I mean, I know, right? Okay, yeah. So Buster didn't really go free though. He still had an answer for those two violations against his probation. Oh, I want to slap someone with my shoe right now. His probation would be revoked and he would go back to jail, but for how long, nobody really knew. On Friday, June 12th, Buster left the courthouse jail without handcuffs or a deputy to escort him. Excellent. All right. Flabbergasted? I mean, I'm literally speechless because in any other case on this planet that it doesn't work like that. It doesn't work like that. Well, I think the things that really helped were it was obvious that the county didn't do its due diligence in handling this case. On top of that, you have this receipt book, and then to learn like, oh, well, the dates don't match when you say you paid it, and then to turn around and find out that the date had literally been changed. Thank goodness for that Royce Rudder who noticed in the first place because it could have gone a whole different way. Absolutely. And it's just shocking that the entity in this that kept doing everything wrong actually ended up paying for it because they did it all wrong, and look what happens when you do it all wrong. You waste all this time. You waste all your energy, all this money. Right. Yeah, you're absolutely right. So Buster made his $2,000 bond pending appeal on the relocation of his probation. Josie Warren, she ended up dying of cancer in 1956, and in 1973 Robert Warren also died from cancer. As of 2019 when this book was written, only Phyllis's brother, Billy Dale Warren, was still alive. I'm not sure if he still is today. His family said he wouldn't participate in an interview, and the Warren sons remained to protect the Warren family, but I have a theory that we'll talk about in a minute. Okay. Well, and didn't you say too after the trial was all done the parents didn't even want anyone to do anything? Yeah, I mean I read that her brothers, if one of their wives brought Phyllis up, they got shut down quick. It was sketchy to me. Very suspicious. So as of this writing, the murder of Phyllis Jean Warren remains unsolved. Buster was sent to prison on July 23, 1953, and was released two years later. The Omelove clan ended up moving to Colorado, but that didn't last long. So Buster's dad, Ellis, got busted for writing bad checks. So after a few years, the young wolves moved to Muskogee, and then later moved back to Tulsa. Betty and Buster got divorced, and Betty stayed in Tulsa while Buster moved to Colorado with his family. Buster wasn't able to stay out of trouble. When living in Muskogee, he stole a welfare check from someone's mailbox and cashed it because Ortiz caught up to him in Tulsa, and he served three years in prison for that crime. Once out of prison, Buster opened up a bar in Muskogee with his brother Clarence. He ended up getting remarried to another woman. Weirdly enough, her name was Betty. They remained married for several years. She passed away after suffering a heart attack while driving and was killed in the wreck. Shortly after that, the bar he had with his brother, it failed. Kookily enough, he met up with his ex-wife Betty, and they pretty much had this on-again, off-again kind of relationship throughout the rest of his life. Later in life, Buster started to lose his mind to dementia. I think he said he lived with his, I believe it was his nephew or something, up in Chelsea. Buster Jr., after he retired from the U.S. Air Force, took his dad in to live with him and his wife in Inola, Oklahoma, but Buster Sr. wasn't really having it. He didn't want to be in Inola. He wanted to be back and stay with his family in Chelsea. For those who might not know, Inola is about 30 minutes east of Tulsa, and Chelsea is about an hour north, for those of you who don't know. On one crazy, hot summer day, Buster went missing, and his family searched for him everywhere. When he was living with his son and he wanted to go back, he had only been with his son for like a week, and his son was like, okay, well, we'll take you back. Well, he got impatient, so he decided to make the trip himself. Oh, no. He didn't get a car. He started walking. So his family searched for him everywhere, but when he was gone for two days, they began to fear the worst. A stranger in town had given him a ride part of the way, and he tried to walk the rest of the way back home to Chelsea. Oh, no. So the brutal Oklahoma heat got to him. Buster's niece found him dead in a ditch about a mile and a half from his family's home. Oh, my gosh. He'd have made it that far? On July 6, 2008. So, I mean, it was hot, you know. It was so hot. Oh, I remember the summer of 2008. He was 76 years old. Elliot Howe had a long, honorable law career in private practice. He was affiliated with several different organizations. I didn't list them all because there was a lot. After the trial, he never had anything to do with Buster Youngwolf again. Like, I think it was like, oh, I did my part. Now he can go and live his life how he wants. It just was never a, let's stay in contact, you know. He no longer wanted to be in criminal law. I can't imagine why. So he spent the rest of his career in just general practice. Howe passed away from lung cancer on January 21, 2007, which just so happened to be his wife Imelda's 82nd birthday. She followed him just 10 months later on October 18, 2007, and they were married for 57 years. So who killed Phyllis Jean Warren? Hunter Howe Cates, the author of Oklahoma Atticus, he's Elliot Howe's grandson. He wrote that he's not accusing anyone or making formal charges. He's just reporting what his grandfather believed and why. So Phyllis Jean Warren's body was found exactly three weeks to the day after she had gone missing, hastily buried in a place that people in the neighborhood pass by almost every single day, in an area that had been searched from top to bottom. However, on the morning of April 2, 1953, when all hope for finding Phyllis had pretty much been lost, her body was discovered in a brush pile just a few blocks from her home, and the person who just happened to find her was her father, Robert Warren. Elliot Howe believed that Robert Warren killed his daughter. During his interviews and investigation, Howe learned that Robert had frequently visited the location where Phyllis's body would be found, almost as if he was checking on something. The dirt where she was buried was packed so tightly that it would have been impossible for someone to use their bare hands to dig a grave, and not to mention the maggots that were found in Phyllis's mouth during the autopsy, revealing that she was not buried on the same day that she was killed. Now, we don't know if he actually killed her or not, but Elliot Howe did believe that he did, but unsure of the reason why. And I find it concerning too, since her panties were bloodied and found in her pocket, and it was shown that she had been raped, and that's a scary thought to think that her father might have done that. Right. And with other people reporting that she had been knowledgeable in the ways of older women. It makes you wonder if she really was. What was going on at home. Right. Or what was going on at home. But it could be what was going on at home. Yeah, and this brings me to the point of how her brothers never wanted to talk about it. Right. They may have known what was happening, but they didn't want to say anything because they were... They were implicated as well. As if they knew that that was going on. I mean, for a child to go against what their father is doing would be very difficult. And if that's their dad doing it, and that's what he's capable of doing, what would he do? Right. Now, I'm not saying he did do it. I don't know, but this is all speculation. But it does bring up some points. Yeah, it does fit. It does fit. So, it's been so many years since Phyllis Jean Warren was murdered, and to this day the case remains unsolved. And that, my friends, is the murder of Phyllis Jean Warren completed. Wow. I'm sorry that took so long. Wow, no. Great. Great episode. Great case. Heartbreaking case. I highly recommend, if you guys have a chance, go out and get Hunter Howell-Cates' book, Oklahoma Atticus. It is worth the read. There are so many details that I didn't leave in, even though I felt like I talked y'all's ear off for four episodes. I highly recommend reading it. Or, if reading's not your thing, get the audiobook. Right, exactly. And, you know, you can... And thanks to Jeff and Matt for actually recommending it to me, like, a year ago before we started this. Definitely. For those of you who maybe don't want to go out and buy the book or the audiobook, you know your local libraries now? Absolutely. They allow you to borrow audiobooks and books, e-books. Absolutely. So, if that's an option for you. But, Jeff, great job. Oh, thank you. Great job. I'm so proud of you. That was the doozy of a case. I honestly thought, oh... Because this all started because you were going out of town for your conference. Right. I thought, oh, well, I'll handle this. I've got her. I'll make this quick. And, like, a month later... I'm sorry. It's okay. It's fine. No, it's fine. It's good. But I think we need to do something a little lighter. Yes. Well, so next week... Next week, don't forget, we are not doing dark history. We are not. We're not going to. We're going to flop. We're going to flop because it's the week of Halloween. We need something lighter. We need something lighter, and we're going to talk about our spooky experience. We're going to talk about the Lindley Hospital. At the Lindley Hospital in Duncan. So, come back. Yes, please come back in here. We've got some spookies. And then I'll finally share my pictures that I took online. So, really, really excited. Please, guys, please, we are loving it. We are at 98 followers on Instagram. Oh, are we? I haven't been on. Yeah, 98 followers on Instagram. So, two more, and we'll have another drawing. I ordered a new mic. No, I'm just kidding. I did order a new mic. Already. I ordered Crystal's book, our winner from our last one. Oh, yes. She chose Notorious Oklahoma Cases. Okay. So, that is a great book. That's a book that you and I both use a lot. So, I mean, once that gets here from Amazon, then I'll go ahead, and I will ship it out to her. Yeah. So, hopefully she will. Congratulations again, Crystal. Yes, congratulations again, Crystal. So, two more followers on Instagram, and we'll have another one. So, get your friends to follow. And, yeah, make sure that you're following us and keeping up with us on all of our socials. Make sure that you rate, review, and follow us on your favorite podcast listening platform. And, if you have any questions, concerns, if you have listener tales or show suggestions, you can always reach us at CuriousCousinsOkay at gmail.com. And, that's the same for all of our socials, too, to look for us. And, just tell them what to keep it. Keep it cookie and spooky. Bye.